Can Sherdog finally put "K-1 striking" myth to rest?

[(ntt)]

I admit I have over estimated K-1 fighters standup skills in past. I thought they have huge edge against MMA fighters but it doesnt seem to be case.

 

[Sherkity**]

Boxing > k1 > mma

Level of striking

 

[Nerdslayer]

What myth? Different sports. K-1 Champ is still very impressive, but MMA has way more to it than just striking.

 

[The ScorpioN]

The standard of K-1 dropped significantly in recent years, and is today little more than barrel scrapings. When a roided-to-the-gills Reem won the GP, he narrowly beat an enormously undersized Tyrone Spong, an injured Saki, and an old, exhausted Aerts. He is not representative of the technical ability of the old stock of HW K-1 guys who in their day were legitimately very good. Aerts, Hoost, Hug, Cro Cop, Bonjasky etc. were the best at their craft in the 90s and you can't really argue otherwise. There are still some good HWs (Saki in particular I consider actually great) but not many compared to K-1's heyday, and most of now them fight in Glory.

That said, being a top kickboxer doesn't necessarily translate to being a top MMA fighter or even a top striker in an MMA setting. Certain styles are better translated to an MMA game than others. This, I imagine, would be the same for boxers though not many top guys have made the crossover. Cro Cop was a top athlete and a very explosive fighter with a boxing pedigree so was able to have a great deal of success fighting in Pride. 'K-1 striking' is not a myth since it is still beneficial to have that background of long-term striking training but it cannot be assumed whoever has that experience will automatically have a striking advantage over all of their MMA opponents. To indulge that line of thinking is to seriously misunderstand MMA in general.

K1 YOUTUBE CHANNEL

Watch a couple of videos from this excellent channel and you will see how good some of these guys were.

K-1 level post right here.

 

[FierceHitman]

The standard of K-1 dropped significantly in recent years, and is today little more than barrel scrapings. When a roided-to-the-gills Reem won the GP, he narrowly beat an enormously undersized Tyrone Spong, an injured Saki, and an old, exhausted Aerts. He is not representative of the technical ability of the old stock of HW K-1 guys who in their day were legitimately very good. Aerts, Hoost, Hug, Cro Cop, Bonjasky etc. were the best at their craft in the 90s and you can't really argue otherwise. There are still some good HWs (Saki in particular I consider actually great) but not many compared to K-1's heyday, and most of now them fight in Glory.

That said, being a top kickboxer doesn't necessarily translate to being a top MMA fighter or even a top striker in an MMA setting. Certain styles are better translated to an MMA game than others. This, I imagine, would be the same for boxers though not many top guys have made the crossover. Cro Cop was a top athlete and a very explosive fighter with a boxing pedigree so was able to have a great deal of success fighting in Pride. 'K-1 striking' is not a myth since it is still beneficial to have that background of long-term striking training but it cannot be assumed whoever has that experience will automatically have a striking advantage over all of their MMA opponents. To indulge that line of thinking is to seriously misunderstand MMA in general.

K1 YOUTUBE CHANNEL

Watch a couple of videos from this excellent channel and you will see how good some of these guys were.

Well put. Remembering Cro Cop's mma debut period. You would be crazy to want to stand with him. :icon_evil

 

[Bmurray]

K1 striking does mean something; nobody is doubts overeems power or striking effectiveness.

Unfortunately I think K1 also left Reem some bad habits when it comes to head-strike defense. I think the same can be said of Boxers who think they can weather a few shots, only to be KO'd.

 

[Stev3]

It's "Glory striking" now

 

[JiuJizzle]

Dude, it's a different sport with a few overlapping areas of MMA.

People becoming better strikers by competing in K1 is a fact, not a myth.
Whatever they do with that in MMA is an entirely different question.

Go line up some MMA guys to have a kickboxing match with Semmy Schilt and make some popcorn.

Well said.

Same goes for any aspect of MMA. Using the TS's rationale, one could argue that the excellence in submission grappling that Fabricio Werdum has shown time and time again versus the best in the world at ADCC is nothing but a myth because he was decisioned by a K-1 world champion in Overeem.

Apples to oranges.

 

[BeardotheWeirdo]

As for Overeem, he has a shotty chin that's much easier to cover up with full sized kickboxing gloves then with thin mma gloves. Give him full sized gloves and he would beat any UFC HW still, imo., but it wouldn`t be mma cause you can`t grapple wit boxing gloves on.

And this also shows that you can`t really compare mma and kickboxing. There`s many differences.

 

[grimballer]

AO doesn't represent the entire K-1 org and every fighter.

Bob Sapp didn't win THE grand prix, he won the Japan GP. He lost in the World GP.

bob sapp beat hoost 3 times

 

[roman510]

Boxing > k1 > mma

Level of striking

Dude, boxer would get DESTROYED in a K-1 match. No lie. U gotta realize that striking aint just hands.

 

[Sherkity**]

Dude, boxer would get DESTROYED in a K-1 match. No lie. U gotta realize that striking aint just hands.

And a kickboxer would get destroyed by a boxer in a boxing match. No lie, u gotta realize that boxing is boxing not kick boxing

 

[Nerdslayer]

bob sapp beat hoost 3 times

And Cro Cop murdered him, as did Bonjasky, Sefo, Aerts, and more

 

[grimballer]

I remember there was a time, if anyone competed in K-1, that meant to a lot of sherdoggers they were going to knock out everyone in MMA. For the longest time I scratched my head at this theory, because time after time, we've seen these world class strikers get knocked out in highlight reel fashion by much "lesser" strikers.

But after seeing the destruction of the Reem can we all just admit K-1 striking means jack shit? Reem has some of the worst striking defense we've ever seen in MMA, and I'm not blaming his chin (although, it's not the best), because he usually just gives up for whatever reason and takes a beatdown. To top it off, he throws virtually no combinations what so ever. How did this guy win the K-1 Grand Prix? Well, I guess even Bob Sapp of all people won the K-1 Grand Prix.

k1 is only 3 3 minutes rounds.

if you noticed overeems always kicking azz in 1st round, then gasses.

 

[lfd0311]

without things like K-1 level striking, Motivated BJ, Chuck with that look in his eyes, Brock pre surgery, Pre accident Mir, Prime Shogun and Strikeforce Nick Diaz, Sherdog wouldn't be fun anymore

 

[grimballer]

And Cro Cop murdered him, as did Bonjasky, Sefo, Aerts, and more

k...

how that changed the FACT that he beat one of the greatest kickboxers 3 times?

if weidman beats anderson again, but then gets beat by top mw, is he all of a sudden a bum?

 

[BrainLeakage]

It's all about the context:

- Boxers are the best in a boxing environment
- Kickboxers are the best in a K1 environment
- MMArtists are the best in a Unified Rules environment

Put anyone of them outside their environment and they lose.

(there are of course exceptions, but it's a good rule of thumb)

 

[Pakman]

I like how TS uses Overeem as an example of a "bad" chin, but the guy has been KO'd by...Liddell, Shogun, Lil Nog, Sergei, Travis Brownie and Bigfoot (maybe 1 or two im just talkin about his pride/ufc'ish career)

Those dudes are literally known for KO'ing their opponents. It's not very hard for a 250 lb man to KO another 250 lb man by landing clean shots on the chin. and did everyone shit on Babalu or Randy or anyone Liddell ever faced because they got KO'd? Isn't that what he was KNOWN to do? Same with Shogun? Sergei?

Alistair may not have the most sturdy chin, but, he's really only been KO'd by guys known to KO people.

Also, K1 striking is vastly different than MMA, 12 oz gloves aren't the same as 4 oz ones.

 

[roman510]

And a kickboxer would get destroyed by a boxer in a boxing match. No lie, u gotta realize that boxing is boxing not kick boxing

Right, but this thread is still about level of 'striking', and if we keep it striking, box, my friend, is an ass.

 

[Poseidon]

Apples/oranges. In K-1 Ovreem would have wiped the floor with the entire UFC roster, including Dos Santos, and he would have done it with ease. MMA you have to constantly worry about the TD, smaller gloves etc