California: Man released from prison after 25 years on death row , due to FALSE testimony

[Prime Rib]

They need to pay this man.

 

[Ruprecht]

The US is the ONLY Western nation that still retains Capital punishment. Infact many non-Western countries have abolished it, while others don't use in practice.

Look at the company the US is in. Oh and the Telegraph is a right of center, pro conservative party paper.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/maps-and-graphics/countries-that-still-have-the-death-penalty/

I'm against the death penalty, but that's a pretty restrictive definition of "Western".
I'd call Japan and Singapore "Western".

 

[Islam Imamate]

1: Well of course you don't. C'mon man, it's an opinion. No human has to do anything ever. You can hold in your shit if you want to until you fucking die. Does that mean you don't have to shit? Are we being semantically literal here? Glad you're not my wife!

Point being there is no reason to execute people other than to appeal to the most base our emotions which have no place in the legal system.

2: Disclaimer: I'm speaking in ideal world.
Of course every single thing administrated by the legal system or the government is a big giant waste of everything.

Its not a waste, if it was "efficient" maybe poor cunts like the guy in the OP would get executed before they had a chance to prove their innocence. Do you want a fast tracked execution process knowing people get exonerated off death row?

3: Idk if they do forensics on shit like this, just to back up their case. But he actually collected all the shell casings and put them in a bag, but accidentally left them at the scene. Idk why they didn't get prints so that's kinda fucked.

Anyways, Jessie Dotson is the guy's name if you're interested. Amongst the murdered were his brother and two nephews.

Sounds like the guy did it but I'm just trying to point out that certain kinds of evidence that are very convincing to juries, like eye witness and confessions, are in fact highly prone to errors.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I'm against the death penalty, but that's a pretty restrictive definition of "Western".
I'd call Japan and Singapore "Western".

You'd call two countries in Far East Asia "Western"?

 

[Ruprecht]

You'd call two countries in Far East Asia "Western"?

Yeah, politically "The West" is usually used more to refer to economically developed liberal democracies than anything else. Same reason Israel is usually included and countries like Moldova excluded. Cold War alliances are another definition frequently used.

 

[Cuauhtemoc]

Yeah, politically "The West" is usually used more to refer to economically developed liberal democracies than anything else. Same reason Israel is usually included and countries like Moldova excluded.

Singapore is neither liberal nor democratic. They even have physical punishment there, they hit people with canes. The same party has been in power forever and the last president won after all the other candidates were considered ineligible.
They're as democratic as the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Yeah, politically "The West" is usually used more to refer to economically developed liberal democracies than anything else. Same reason Israel is usually included and countries like Moldova excluded.

I don't really like that usage of the term tbh, doesn't really make sense to me. If the whole world turns into developed liberal democracies is the whole world "Western"? And it often excludes most of the Western hemisphere which is silly to me.

 

[Madmick]

If liberals are going to get outraged by this, then they've got to drop the #metoo act.

 

[Ruprecht]

Singapore is neither liberal nor democratic. They even have physical punishment there, they hit people with canes. The same party has been in power forever and the last president won after all the other candidates were considered ineligible.
They're as democratic as the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.

Singapore is democratic, but you're right that it's not a liberal democracy (it's typically referred to as the definitive "illiberal democracy"). However I'd still call it Western due to the level of development, Cold War first world status and the extent to which it inherited English common law.

 

[Ruprecht]

I don't really like that usage of the term tbh, doesn't really make sense to me. If the whole world turns into developed liberal democracies is the whole world "Western"? And it often excludes most of the Western hemisphere which is silly to me.

Geographically Australia isn't in the Western Hemisphere either, but it's included in the cold war, developmental and cultural inheritance based definitions.
Economic development (increasingly including globalisation) and democratisation is usually referred to as "Westernisation" everywhere I've been.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Geographically Australia isn't in the Western Hemisphere either, but it's included in the cold war, developmental and cultural inheritance based definitions.

I get Australia more so because at least its Western in its cultural roots but Singapore and Japan are as Asian as it gets.

 

[Ruprecht]

I get Australia more so because at least its Western in its cultural roots but Singapore and Japan are as Asian as it gets.

Singapore's current structure is almost as much of a legacy of it's time as a British colony as Australia's, and the definition of "the West" is usually dependent on the dichotomy being described. Does the abolition of the death penalty revolve around a cultural dichotomy? I would think economic and human rights development would be the axis.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Singapore's current structure is almost as much of a legacy of it's time as a British colony as Australia's, and the definition of "the West" is usually dependent on the dichotomy being described. Does the abolition of the death penalty revolve around a cultural dichotomy? I would think economic and human rights development would be the axis.

Politically sure its Western in its structure but I think culturally Singapore is distinct from the West and Japan is definitely so.

I'm not sure this semantic argument I'm making here is really relevant though since what matters is what @MicroBrew meant.

 

[Makani]

Most of the time false testimony is not malicious but rather a mistake. Do you prosecute people for a mistake? I say no but you do take the possibility of mistakes into account and act accordingly.

Most vehicle related fatalities are accidental, but manslaughter and reckless driving are still crimes.

 

[Ruprecht]

Politically sure its Western in its structure but I think culturally Singapore is distinct from the West and Japan is definitely so.

I'm not sure this semantic argument I'm making here is really relevant though since what matters is what @MicroBrew meant.

Sure, and since he said the US is the only Western nation that retains the death penalty I'm sure he meant Western Europe, Australia, New Zealand, Canada and America as "the West". I'm just not sure it's a meaningful grouping in terms of reasons behind the abolition of the death penalty.
The US retention of the death penalty is unusual in that the US legal system has such a strong focus on individual rights and restrictions on Government power, which is usually what leads to abolition. In the US democratic populism won out.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Most vehicle related fatalities are accidental, but manslaughter and reckless driving are still crimes.

That's true but I think prosecuting people for honest mistakes like this would have an adverse affect on the justice system. If you knew you could get prosecuted for an honest mistake you'd be less likely to cooperate with law enforcement I'd imagine.

 

[MicroBrew]

I'm against the death penalty, but that's a pretty restrictive definition of "Western".
I'd call Japan and Singapore "Western".

My understanding of the perception and definition of Western = countries created by and mostly peopled by Western Europeans. This is also how people in the MiddleEast perceived "the West" as. Singapore and Japan are East Asian.

 

[Neph]

Death is cheaper and it's not torture. I think that kind of torture is overkill. Just whack the guy.

The death penalty is actually frequently more expensive, at least in countries that have a justice system that isn't corrupt to the core. A quick google for 'cost of the death penalty' will reveal a wide range of estimates but most put them literally millions of dollars more expensive per case.

As to torture it is when it goes wrong which is more common than what we should accept. Lethal injection is administered by prison orderlies (doctors have a Hippocratic Oath to observe) who may or may not be experts on this and are often putting needles into drug addicts arms where veins are almost impossible to find due to a lifetime of abuse. A botched injection can result in gruesome results. The reason someone is strapped down for injections and the gas chamber is that if the administration is done incorrectly the body can break its own bones in muscular reactions and almost turn itself inside out from contortions. The person being killed can well be alive for a good part of that.

 

[gspieler]

How does one "lose track" of a 2yr old? Especially in a place where there are motor vehicles. The guy obviously didn't deserve to sit on death row, but I am I the only one who read the op and thought he at least sounded negligent?

 

[sangreporsangre]

How does one "lose track" of a 2yr old? Especially in a place where there are motor vehicles. The guy obviously didn't deserve to sit on death row, but I am I the only one who read the op and thought he at least sounded negligent?

Yea man, criminally negligent. As far as the family of that girl is concerned I guess it's nice to find out that the guy isn't a monster after all but I doubt they'll be throwing any parades for him. Obviously what happened to him at trial was a miscarriage of justice but let's not lose sight that the biggest tragedy here was that this baby girl who was under his care died a violent death. "Lost track" of her? You're not sure whether or not a kid not even fuckin 2 years old got hit by a car? How did she get outside, and wtf were you doing?? He didn't deserve a death sentence (if that was my kid of course I would be singing a different tune) but he should have done some serious time for that. His negligence was reprehensible. He has to live with that, and he's had more time than most to reflect on the consequences of his decisions in life so I hope he does some good with the time he has left.