Bruce Lee on the Heavy Bag

because he was the one to have the idea but also a huge media profile to broadcast it as well as being articulate and charismatic enough to bring the strengths of the idea across.

The ideas were well known already within the martial arts community - all Bruce Lee did was bring the idea to the global stage & influence the next generation.

His martial contributions pale in significance to others...I have no bias against the man but why can't people accept that & make him out to be something he probably wasn't.
 
because he was the one to have the idea but also a huge media profile to broadcast it as well as being articulate and charismatic enough to bring the strengths of the idea across.

Well judging by how crappy average Jeet Kune Do turned out to be with MOST of its practitioners being the average, run of the mill, non-fighters who sings that standard bullshit song about how too dangerous they are for Sports fighting....I'd say, Bruce Lee was mostly, hype.

The real deal were the Gracies. The Gracies backed up their mouths and fought anyone who stepped up. And the UFC opened people's eyes to many things the are bullshit in TMA's including Bruce Lee's bullshit.
 
Kids grow up... He was just an actor who trained martial arts...
He didn't fight competitively nor wasn't street fighter, he was just martial arts enthusiast and tv actor. Thats it.

In REAL fight I bet he would went chaotic brawling like a crazy cat.

But he was great inspiration for generation of real fighters.

I know this is an old thread.... But stupid comments like the above are always too much to not respond to.... It is a known fact he was a streetfighter above all. It is also known that when he fought, he methodically picked fighters apart. Pic up a book... use google... Here... I'll make it easy for you:
Interviewer: We know Bruce was an excellent screen fighter, but he could REALLY fight?

Bob Wall: "Let's get something straight, Bruce Lee was the real deal. I know alot of people think he was only good on the screen but they are wrong. Dead wrong! Many people have already had found out the hard way just how wrong they were!"

Interviewer: How did he train to be such a competent fighter?

Bob Wall: "You have got to remember where Bruce came from. He fought constantly as a teenager in Hong Kong. He used to be in a gang, so he was quite used to fighting. I remember talking to his family when we were filming Enter the Dragon in Hong Kong, and they said Bruce would sometimes come home all bloody, and they thought he was going to die, only to find out the blood came from the guy he had just beat up! Oh, Bruce lost his share of fights too, and this is one reason he became so intent on taking up a martial art. Because if you can't fight well, it could get you killed. One day he wondered what would happen if he was caught without his gang, and his parents took him to Yip Man, a well known Wing Chun instructor in Hong Kong. A few years later, Bruce's parents were being contacted by the Hong Kong police so often for fighting, they said if he gets caught one more time, he's going to jail.
This caused his parents to send him to America and start a new life here.
Moving ahead many years later, Bruce came up with the idea to spar full contact making the training as real as possible.
He fought with anyone that was willing. I've fought with Bruce myself a number of times, and had witnessed or had heard of many sparring sessions not just with other martial artists, but with champion Karate fighters, such as Louis Delgado, Skipper Mullins, Jim Kelly, Pat Burleson, Chuck Norris, Allen Steen and a few others. You have got to understand where these guys had come from in terms of practical self defense. While some came from the streets as Mullins and Steen had, most of these guys were used to fighting within the confines of a ring, so what Bruce was doing was a real wake up call for them."

Interviewer: What do you mean wake up call?

Bob Wall: "Well, it's like this...all great fighters have the same make-up in terms of intensity, commitment, will, drive and of course talent. Now, you have to remember that the type of fighting most Karate champions were used to, had rules and restrictions. It was SUPPOSED to be no contact to light contact, but people were always getting hurt, some quite badly, so they were used to contact. And even though many of these guys were really tough, I mean REALLY tough, and could take it as well as dish it out, they weren't prepared for Bruce.
Just the look on their faces was a sight to behold when Bruce would just move in and shut them down. They were used to trading punches and kicks with other fast and powerful opponents, and scoring on them frequently. You know, more evenly matched. I know it was hard for me to deal with the frustration when sparring with Bruce, and I know it was exceptionally hard for alot of them.
Especially since Bruce never fought professionally."


Interviewer: It must have been embarrassing for some of these guys.

Bob Wall: "Think about it this way...many of these guys were WORLD CHAMPIONS. They had faced and defeated the best in the business accross the globe. They are proud fighters. Who wouldn't be humiliated losing to a guy who has not fought professionally, and has no rank or certification to boot? It is my opinion that losing to Bruce in some ways was more devastating than losing a title fight. At least in a title fight, you know your opponent worked his butt off to get there, and it took a great deal of time. Many years of hard work, and paying your dues. Then you fight this little 140 pound guy and he just cleans your clock."

Interviewer: Can you really call them fights? I mean, sparring isn't really fighting is it?

Wall: "YOU tell these guys they weren't real fights. It was damn brutal!
In fact, most of these guys have never taken that kind of punishment before, but they sure learned the difference between what they were used to, and what they were learning from Bruce!

Interviewer: Were there any rules, or did you really try and hurt each other?

Bob Wall: "Well, we certainly didn't want to see anyone get hurt, that's just an inevitability sometimes. And no, the only rule was no following through with joint locks. If we did follow through, reconstructive surgery would be needed.

Interviewer So Bruce fought with grapplers too?

Bob Wall: "Bruce fought with EVERYBODY! Anyone who wanted to spar was welcome. We had people from every type of combat imaginable from punchers and kickers, to wrestlers, boxers, and everyone in between. Bruce loved to train, and we loved to train too. The list of people who worked with Bruce at one point in his life or another, reads like a who's who in the martial arts community.
I want you to understand that it wasn't like Bruce came in and kicked everyone's butt, and was all high and mighty. It's just that Bruce could pick things up very quickly, and adapt what he learned into his personal way of fighting almost immediately. Now, don't get me wrong, Bruce was learning right along with the rest of us, and I'm sure he would be the first to admit that.
He once told me that if you ever think you've learned everything, your dead in the water. It just seemed to us that Bruce was alot farther down the path to self mastery than any of the other people in the martial arts at that time.
 
Bruce was about practical application. Its stupid to think he never fought. And he was against ring sports.
 
what a nonsense thread, i bet my house id knock that twig out in 20.


( lets see how easy bruce fanboys are to get mad lol )
 
Bruce was about practical application. Its stupid to think he never fought. And he was against ring sports.
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I agree he was most likely about practical application, but it is a misnomer he was against sport fighting. He courted, and trained Joe Lewis, specifically to represent JKD, and they created a new rule set for it. He didnt like point fighting, or non continuous sparring, he didnt like judges or restrictive rule sets, but he loved combat sports, and watched as much as he could.
 
Bruce was about practical application. Its stupid to think he never fought. And he was against ring sports.

This isnt true. He competed in highschool boxing and won a championship in his school and jack dempsey was also very influential to his jkd.

Bolo yeung also claimed the reason bruce trained like a psychotic was because he thought it could potentially lead to a freak show fight with ali one day
 
The ideas were well known already within the martial arts community - all Bruce Lee did was bring the idea to the global stage & influence the next generation.

His martial contributions pale in significance to others...I have no bias against the man but why can't people accept that & make him out to be something he probably wasn't.

All he did was influence the entire globe and multiple applications of athletics beyond a generation? Yeah, sounds so miniscule when you put it like that.

Well judging by how crappy average Jeet Kune Do turned out to be with MOST of its practitioners being the average, run of the mill, non-fighters who sings that standard bullshit song about how too dangerous they are for Sports fighting....I'd say, Bruce Lee was mostly, hype.

The real deal were the Gracies. The Gracies backed up their mouths and fought anyone who stepped up. And the UFC opened people's eyes to many things the are bullshit in TMA's including Bruce Lee's bullshit.

You might be surprised if you actually did some digging about the Gracies, because reality doesn't quite hold up to what you're selling there.
 
Back then, when I was in high school, every kid would ask "how many swat team members would Bruce Lee beat up at once?" and we would all be like "20... no 30" Then we would be like "how many do you think Jet Li would beat up at once?" and we would then say "dunno probably about 4-5."

That was when we were young and naive. Then I opened my eyes and thought... He probably can't do that. So yeah I agree people do immortalize and give him godlike status in the martial arts world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWj-zU8koes
this shows that Bruce Lee's movements in real time and honestly I could not see the more complicated ones, and even simple punches are damn fast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILQ06Wqg4g8
at 0:50 he counters someone's punch. I don't know if this is edited or not and it looks edited but if it isn't... that is cray.

Although, I don't believe he, in his prime, can beat up any of the top mma fighters, I do believe that, with the right training, he would be a match.
 
No way the Red Baron could fight Capt. Steve Ritchie in their period aircraft.
 
Although, I don't believe he, in his prime, can beat up any of the top mma fighters, I do believe that, with the right training, he would be a match.

I train JKD, and I realy wish people knew more about it. Bruce could have been a terrible fighter, but the martial art he created was way ahead of its time.
 
I dunno what's worse:

1) Bruce Lee fanboys who speak of him as though he could walk on water and catch bullets in his teeth.

2) Bruce Lee anti-fanboys who pounce on any opportunity to take a shit on him with the same zeal and intensity that the fanboys laud his superhuman awesomeness...while claiming they can't understand the fanboy mindset.

Bruce Lee was, by any fair estimation, a skilled and accomplished martial artist. He was also an educated, highly-intelligent man, a famously voracious reader who applied his intellectual prowess as much as his physical ability towards martial arts and physical fitness.

Even if his ideas regarding the rigidity and limitations of the "traditional" paradigm of MA training weren't 100% original or uniquely his own, they were considered radical enough to make him a polarizing (and often hated) figure.

Could Bruce Lee beat up a top-ranked MMA fighter? Maybe he could. Maybe he couldn't. Personally, my feelings on the subject are much the same as they are... [CONT'D]
 
[CONT'D] ...with "Could a shark beat up an alligator?" or "Could my dad beat up your dad?"

To whit: "We'll never know, it's not really that important anyway, so who gives a fuck? And my dad would stomp a mudhole in your dads' ass any day of the week, and twice on Sunday."

Bruce Lee wasn't "an actor who studied martial arts." He made a few films as a kid in Hong Kong, and was a child actor of some note. He left that behind when he devoted his time and energy to training in Wing Chun kung fu.

Years later, he was lured back to movies by Golden Harvest Studios, a premiere purveyor of chop-socky matinee flicks in Hong Kong that had it in mind to capitalize on his growing notoriety as a martial artist and actor (the latter due to playing Kano on "The Green Hornet").

But it's not like to guy was Tony Jaa or something. In fact, one of Bruce's lesser-known contributions had to do with choreographing fight scenes involving Eastern martial arts.

Did Bruce Lee fight competetively? No. Then again... [CONT'D]
 
I dunno what's worse:

1) Bruce Lee fanboys who speak of him as though he could walk on water and catch bullets in his teeth.

2) Bruce Lee anti-fanboys who pounce on any opportunity to take a shit on him with the same zeal and intensity that the fanboys laud his superhuman awesomeness...while claiming they can't understand the fanboy mindset.

Bruce Lee was, by any fair estimation, a skilled and accomplished martial artist. He was also an educated, highly-intelligent man, a famously voracious reader who applied his intellectual prowess as much as his physical ability towards martial arts and physical fitness.

Even if his ideas regarding the rigidity and limitations of the "traditional" paradigm of MA training weren't 100% original or uniquely his own, they were considered radical enough to make him a polarizing (and often hated) figure.

Could Bruce Lee beat up a top-ranked MMA fighter? Maybe he could. Maybe he couldn't. Personally, my feelings on the subject are much the same as they are... [CONT'D]

Now he's "educated" on top of being a "teh realz" fighter?! He was expelled from secondary school for poor academic performance for Pete's sake! On top of that, he later lied about his major and the fact that dropped out of U-Dub.

It's crazy how much his estate built up his cult of personality in the West, and people still buy it hook, line, and sinker.

Bruce was a great movie star and a great proponent of martial philosophy, but there's no objective or definitive proof of his actual combat prowess. It's also common knowledge that he was arrogant and lied about many events to make himself look better. He's not terrible but he's not the martial demigod/saint that so many people make him out to be. I've written ad nauseum in other threads about everything that's known about him to the Chinese community that never made it to Westerner's eyes and ears because his estate choked those stories before they were translated -- look it up if you're interested in the objective truth; if you approach with an open mind, you'll come to understand who Bruce really was.

Now cue the flaming and baseless arguments from the fanboys in 3, 2, 1...
 
[CONT'D] ...that this is such a big deal to the same people who-- if Lee *had* competed-- would be the first to point out that MA competitions in those days were little more than slap-boxing and speed-tag, and hardly a meaningful test of practical fightin skill. Which, incidentally, was what Lee thought of them.

As for "real fights:" he did plenty of that. In his younger days, he would try out what he had been learning by dressing up in traditional "coolie" outfits and go hang out where the school-age sons of British administrators and white-collar types were known to hang out (and hassle Chinese kids). It was his propensity for beating up British kids that got him into trouble with the law.

Later, when filming "Enter The Dragon," he was involved in numerous fights with locally-hired extras and stuntmen, many of whom were gang members and criminal tough-asses looking to get some cred by beating up Bruce Lee. By all indications, Bruce dispatched them in decisively quick and brutal fashion.
 
Now he's "educated" on top of being a "teh realz" fighter?!

Nice job completely blowing what I said out of proportion.

He was expelled from secondary school for poor academic performance...he later lied about his major and the fact that dropped out of U-Dub.

He completed his high school education in the US...kinda hard to get into college without a HS diploma. As for "lying about his major," there is some question about whether he majored in Drama/Performing Arts... [CONT'D]


Bruce was a great movie star and a great proponent of martial philosophy, but there's no objective or definitive proof of his actual combat prowess. that he He's not terrible but he's not the martial demigod/saint that so many people make hi everything that's known about him to the Chinese community that never made it to Westerner's eyes and ears because his estate choked those stories before they were translated -- look it up if you're interested in the objective truth; i
 
I think part of the reason why people immortalize him is due to him having that image. He is the man who brought the precursor of the MMA ideology to a global scale.

We remember him for that, and his movies, not for his professional fights. I am a big fan of Bruce Lee. I don't think he was the best fighter ever, but I'd be lying if I said I don't pretend he is.

But I think his main goal is to have the world acknowledge kung fu, or martial arts in general. So to me, he will always be the best martial artist there is largely due to the fact that he broadened the horizon for martial arts.
 
i feel lucky to have watched his films growing up. pretty inspiring for me as a kid.
 

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