Boxing's GOAT and the MMA's GOAT in one picture

Shaddows said:
sorry, but beating Silva post-Weidman or Hendo post TRT (which we both know he didn't even "really win", but UK will gonna UK) and catching Luke (after being humiliated by him)... it amazes me that all of a sudden they are great wins... but the fact he run from all MW's for almost two years, while facing retired fighters from different divisions... you are completely oblivious to it... Hypocrite much?
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OH so Bisping KTFO on Rockhold wasn't a great win? Tell me more about it. Let the hate flow through you, dumbass.

I know it's very hard for you to accept it, but GSP >>>>>> Silva and it's not even close. Stop trying to convince yourself.
 
sapporo ichiban said:
Fair enough.

The whole thing about the division being on hold may be a bit trickier than that though. As far as I was aware, Bisping was booked against Hendo when many felt that Romero should have been in that slot. Bisping GSP was going to be booked and then it was revealed that he would not make a suitable date and Dana cancelled it. Bisping then got injured and so that delayed things. In the meantime Bobby knuckles shook up the top 5 pretty effectively and shelved a few contenders and then became injured himself. Moose moved on to Bellator and the window for Bisping GSP was reopened.

Between Bisping fighting Hendo and the rash of injuries and contenders being eliminated or moving on, the actual impact that GSP had on the hold up on the division is a lot less than some may remember. Even after his win over Bisping he did not hang onto the strap for any time at all which is not the usual move by fighters in that position. All in all, if I had to put them into columns on paper by time wasted, I would guess that the Hendo fight and injuries were the biggest impact by a fair margin.
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Well, that's the thing.
I don't believe in those "injuries".
Remember, in November, before GSP even agreed to sign with the UFC, there were talks about that fight for December.
And when negotiations with the UFC fell though, Jacare called out Bisping, and he refused because he was "injured". Heck, Bisping even admitted he was good enough to fight GSP but didn't want to risk the belt against Jacare.
Then (by February), ir was Yoel. Same song and dance. Healthy for GSP, not healthy for Yoel.

Then when GSP continue holding back the return date, I recall Bisping giving him an ultimatum (fight me in July or else I'll fight Yoel)... GSO still maintained September. So Dana interviewed, and Bisping had to fight yoel... and amazingly, he got injured again... which he even said "blessing in disguise" as he would be healthy in September, "in time to fight GSP" which he ended up fighting.

So I disagree. Bisping was healthy and claiming injury just so he could accomodate the return date GSP setup and wouldn't move up.

And GSP knew the status of the division. Every top contender had already waited for a full year between Bisping beating Luke then calling Hendo. He made them wait for another year and then just run away from the division.
Sorry, the way it was made was too "in your face" for me to doubt what happen.
Might be even unfair on my side, but as I said, it was just too convenient those injuries exactly when Bisping was paired up against contenders... and healthy exactly when he thought GSP would fight him...
 
ThunderStruck said:
OH so Bisping KTFO on Rockhold wasn't a great win? Tell me more about it. Let the hate flow through you, dumbass.

I know it's very hard for you to accept it, but GSP >>>>>> Silva and it's not even close. Stop trying to convince yourself.
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LOL
one more nutsucker triggered AF...

 
fedor-thumbs-down.gif
 
Shaddows said:
Well, that's the thing.
I don't believe in those "injuries".
Remember, in November, before GSP even agreed to sign with the UFC, there were talks about that fight for December.
And when negotiations with the UFC fell though, Jacare called out Bisping, and he refused because he was "injured". Heck, Bisping even admitted he was good enough to fight GSP but didn't want to risk the belt against Jacare.
Then (by February), ir was Yoel. Same song and dance. Healthy for GSP, not healthy for Yoel.

Then when GSP continue holding back the return date, I recall Bisping giving him an ultimatum (fight me in July or else I'll fight Yoel)... GSO still maintained September. So Dana interviewed, and Bisping had to fight yoel... and amazingly, he got injured again... which he even said "blessing in disguise" as he would be healthy in September, "in time to fight GSP" which he ended up fighting.

So I disagree. Bisping was healthy and claiming injury just so he could accomodate the return date GSP setup and wouldn't move up.

And GSP knew the status of the division. Every top contender had already waited for a full year between Bisping beating Luke then calling Hendo. He made them wait for another year and then just run away from the division.
Sorry, the way it was made was too "in your face" for me to doubt what happen.
Might be even unfair on my side, but as I said, it was just too convenient those injuries exactly when Bisping was paired up against contenders... and healthy exactly when he thought GSP would fight him...
Click to expand...

And based on all this we still hold GSP to blame for holding up the division?
I just read what you wrote and as far as I could tell you kept saying Bisping did this and said that in hopes of fighting GSP. Is it all on GSP that someone would allegedly fake injuries in order to be sure he faces him?

Bisping did not have to fight Hendo. Bisping may or may not have been injured, that is speculation as to whether he was lying. We can't forget that Bobby knuckles took out Hall, Brunson, Jacare, and Romero, he then became injured himself. Luke was not far removed from being slept by the count and Moose left. The company had a choice at that point. Do they plug in whoever is available in the top 5 who would ordinarily not get the crack or do we do the big payday fight?

I am sorry but I can't put in the effort to look for corruption or conspiracy. This whole situation may not have been ideal but at the end of the day, the company enabled this all to happen. Bisping and GSP made a bunch of money to retire with which is nice for those guys, they both gave us blood for years and I wish them well. The division is right where it needs to be now and the guys who should have been at the top are getting their due. I would say it worked out in the end.

I understand that you are disappointed that GSP dropped the belt, I get it. Had I saw him look really good at mw and being a fan then I would feel the same. I didn't like the way he looked at mw and to be honest, I think it would be a stretch to expect him to consistently do as well there at his age as he did at ww. With that said, there is no point in fighting in a weight class that is not a good fit.

The hardcore haters would be salivating at the thought of him continuing too long in a class that is no good because they want to watch the crash and say I told you so. Turns out GSP was too smart for them again and that must piss them off in a big way, lol.
 
Shaddows said:
he run from Hendricks... and then from Whittaker...
Add Silva into the mix...
...seems he only accepts when it is the Dan Hardy's or one-eyed Koschek... and even then, he is afraid to finish them...
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Silva ran from Jon Jones.
GSP fought Hendricks, and then quit because of personnal problems, which seemed legits, since he was gone for 4 fucking years.
 
613 said:
Tyson is arguably not even top 50
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The youngest heavyweight champion in boxing history , was notoriously powerful and intimidating in the ring , had incredible hand speed ( comparable only to the legendary Muhammad Ali ) had great lateral movement and sense of timing

Trevor Berbick ( heavyweight champion at the time , the man Tyson beat to become the youngest heavyweight champion in boxing history ) , beat Larry Holmes ( was never knocked out before facing Tyson ) , Michael Spinks ( undefeated before getting destroyed by Tyson ) , Tony Tucker ( heavyweight champ at the time ), Tyrell Biggs ( olympic gold medallist ) , Pinklon Thomas ( tough as hell ) , James Smith ( was clinching Tyson the whole fight to avoid banging with him , also champion at the time )

All this before turning 25 years old ( in which he admittedly fuck himself up with hooker , booze , streetfights and the rape conviction )

But still

hqg-84.gif
 
sapporo ichiban said:
And based on all this we still hold GSP to blame for holding up the division?
I just read what you wrote and as far as I could tell you kept saying Bisping did this and said that in hopes of fighting GSP. Is it all on GSP that someone would allegedly fake injuries in order to be sure he faces him?

Bisping did not have to fight Hendo. Bisping may or may not have been injured, that is speculation as to whether he was lying. We can't forget that Bobby knuckles took out Hall, Brunson, Jacare, and Romero, he then became injured himself. Luke was not far removed from being slept by the count and Moose left. The company had a choice at that point. Do they plug in whoever is available in the top 5 who would ordinarily not get the crack or do we do the big payday fight?

I am sorry but I can't put in the effort to look for corruption or conspiracy. This whole situation may not have been ideal but at the end of the day, the company enabled this all to happen. Bisping and GSP made a bunch of money to retire with which is nice for those guys, they both gave us blood for years and I wish them well. The division is right where it needs to be now and the guys who should have been at the top are getting their due. I would say it worked out in the end.

I understand that you are disappointed that GSP dropped the belt, I get it. Had I saw him look really good at mw and being a fan then I would feel the same. I didn't like the way he looked at mw and to be honest, I think it would be a stretch to expect him to consistently do as well there at his age as he did at ww. With that said, there is no point in fighting in a weight class that is not a good fit.

The hardcore haters would be salivating at the thought of him continuing too long in a class that is no good because they want to watch the crash and say I told you so. Turns out GSP was too smart for them again and that must piss them off in a big way, lol.
Click to expand...

Meh, I disagree.
GSP saw the whole division waiting for Bisping to fight Hendo. Yet he still dragged on until he signed a contract (by end of January) with full intention to not fight until August/September. That alone shows he did not care for the division. And we both know he accepted this fight BECAUSE it was Bisping.

And the way he left was exactly as you said. Money grabbing and 100% disrespect (or at least don't care) about the sport.

but I agree with you that the greedy UFC is to blame for allowing the fight to happen, though they did try to force GSP to unify the belt by putting that fight into his contract. I guess they were led to believe he would stay for more fights.

And for you to claim "it is nice that GSP & Bisping got to make money for their retirement". Fighters like Yoel and Jacare deserved title shots they didn't get. How fair it was to them? Jacare might never get a new title shot, and he darn well deserved it. (Yoel is getting his, so not so bad, but you know what I mean!).
Besides, let us be honest here. Bisping and GSP both were not hurting for money.
 
MMAfanJabroniJew said:
The youngest heavyweight champion in boxing history , was notoriously powerful and intimidating in the ring , had incredible hand speed ( comparable only to the legendary Muhammad Ali ) had great lateral movement and sense of timing

Trevor Berbick ( heavyweight champion at the time , the man Tyson beat to become the youngest heavyweight champion in boxing history ) , beat Larry Holmes ( was never knocked out before facing Tyson ) , Michael Spinks ( undefeated before getting destroyed by Tyson ) , Tony Tucker ( heavyweight champ at the time ), Tyrell Biggs ( olympic gold medallist ) , Pinklon Thomas ( tough as hell ) , James Smith ( was clinching Tyson the whole fight to avoid banging with him , also champion at the time )

All this before turning 25 years old ( in which he admittedly fuck himself up with hooker , booze , streetfights and the rape conviction )

But still

hqg-84.gif
Click to expand...
Go back and read the list of names you said. If Old man Holmes coming off a loss and LHW Spinks is the best you can come up with, you are just proving my point. Tyson not being a top 50 boxer ever is NOT a crazy statement at all. ESPN ranked him 50th, Ring ranked him like 87th. Most have him outside the top 10 HWs. His best wins are just not close to as good as needed to rank him as anything close to a GOAT. He gets overrated by casuals because his fan friendly style and bad ass persona

Tyson had GOAT POTENTIAL. But anyone who knows Boxing knows he did not have close to a GOAT career. To be honest, ranking him 50th all time is being generous

Its kinda embarrassing that you are bringing up Pinklon Thomas. No GOAT would ever have Pinklon Thomas as one of their best wins

And Tyson doesn't get a pass for being mentally weak and fucking his career up. Tyson COULD have been a GOAT. But he obviously was not even close
 
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