Best Base for MMA?

Cooliox said:
exactly. there's a reason these K1 guys cant adapt to MMA.

meanwhile Brock enters the game a decade removed from his amateur career along with a bunch of nagging injuries from pro-wrestling, and he becomes HW champion.
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Another prime reason is all the TBI incurred from striking exchanged which are largely avoided in grappling exchanges. Even if the lethal stand up of Alistair Overeem should generally prevail simply due to extremely refined technique- often that is all made irrelevant by being made chinny from all the literal war on your body to get there.

Grappling in that sense is the ultimate defensive martial art considering you take far less damage in the long run adopting the techniques.

It's too bad too because I enjoy watching stand up more, but the damage is hard to overlook.
 
The background that produced an undefeated middleweight and most popular heavyweight champion of all time.

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Wrasslin.
 
I think freestyle, greco or catch wrestling are probably the best bases.

Any kind of grappling base (Judo, BJJ, etc) is a legit base

Kickboxing/boxing are good bases too
 
The base is wrestling.

It's not a matter of 'best' or not. The base for MMA is wrestling.
 
prikoke said:
Boxing IMO. Look at fighters like Lawler, JDS, Gus. They were able to learn enough TDD to keep top level wrestlers like Hendricks, Cain and Jones from taking them down and keeping them down.
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Neither Lawler or JDS have any kind of extensive background on boxing.
Lawler has a wrestling background on the other hand.
 
Guile said:
Lawler grew up a wrestler, JDS lost his title to a wrestler and got dominated twice by him and Gus lost to Jones and DC....
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Gus is a MUCH worse fighter than Jones and DC. Think about it, the Jones fight took place in the stand-up which is Gus' strength, and Jones still beat him there. There is no question that Jones is a much better grappler. Same with DC. The fact that Gus, while much worse than Jones, managed to almost beat him, says a lot.

If JDS were a better boxer, ironically he may not have lost to Cain. If he had better head movement and footwork he would not have been as wrecked by Cain against the cage.

Lawler may have wrestled a while ago but his main fighting style is his boxing. It's kind of like people consider GSP more of a wrestler even though his "base" is karate.
 
JohnMangala said:
Another prime reason is all the TBI incurred from striking exchanged which are largely avoided in grappling exchanges. Even if the lethal stand up of Alistair Overeem should generally prevail simply due to extremely refined technique- often that is all made irrelevant by being made chinny from all the literal war on your body to get there.

Grappling in that sense is the ultimate defensive martial art considering you take far less damage in the long run adopting the techniques.

It's too bad too because I enjoy watching stand up more, but the damage is hard to overlook.
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cant disagree with that.

That's also why I'm a big fan of Mayweather's. The dude's a defensive specialist, no one has been able to take as little damage as he's done. That too over a career spanning 49-0 fighting against bigger guys across multiple divisions.

I dont think I've seen another striker be able to negate punishment the way Floyd did. I know the casual fan wants to see wild exchanges to feed their need for TV-adrenaline, but man, Floyd was an artist in there.

Knocked down what, only once or twice in his career? Madness.

Fedor did it in MMA too. While the level of competition wasn't the same, it was unheard of since he fought at HW. He was never knocked down in his prime.
 
FenoxSky said:
Neither Lawler or JDS have any kind of extensive background on boxing.
Lawler has a wrestling background on the other hand.
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If JDS managed to do this damage with his rather limited boxing, imagine what he could have done if he actually had a boxing base in his teens. IIRC he started fighting very late. Robbie grew up wrestling but he uses his boxing most of all to win fights, and uses wrestling mostly defensively. Hell he chose to stand with freaking Manhoef.
 
prikoke said:
Gus is a MUCH worse fighter than Jones and DC. Think about it, the Jones fight took place in the stand-up which is Gus' strength, and Jones still beat him there. There is no question that Jones is a much better grappler. Same with DC. The fact that Gus, while much worse than Jones, managed to almost beat him, says a lot.

If JDS were a better boxer, ironically he may not have lost to Cain. If he had better head movement and footwork he would not have been as wrecked by Cain against the cage.

Lawler may have wrestled a while ago but his main fighting style is his boxing. It's kind of like people consider GSP more of a wrestler even though his "base" is karate.
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We bring up Robbie's background because that's exactly what we're talking about here, backgrounds.
While I agree good boxing seems to be a stellar base for MMA, when taking the appropriate fundamentals and elements, you're not making a good case for it, on this context.
 
prikoke said:
Gus is a MUCH worse fighter than Jones and DC. Think about it, the Jones fight took place in the stand-up which is Gus' strength, and Jones still beat him there. There is no question that Jones is a much better grappler. Same with DC. The fact that Gus, while much worse than Jones, managed to almost beat him, says a lot.

If JDS were a better boxer, ironically he may not have lost to Cain. If he had better head movement and footwork he would not have been as wrecked by Cain against the cage.

Lawler may have wrestled a while ago but his main fighting style is his boxing. It's kind of like people consider GSP more of a wrestler even though his "base" is karate.
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Not entirely considering Jones was choosing to stand up with him and by the end of it was beating him there too and that his strength- that's no joke. More considering would be Gus fight against DC which completely negates your point. But I definitely see what you mean. Boxing is one of my favorite disciplines, I am eager to see Mayweather's avatar in MMA. Hell we were seeing glimpses of Prince Naseem and Roy Jones in Silva; where Silva took it to the next level.
 
I think MMA is evolving past this question. The best base for MMA is MMA. The obvious answer would be wrestling, but now we have strikers that are learning to not get taken down, AND there taking down top grapplers. Gus and Holly both managed to land takedowns on there grapple centric opponents. Do everything at a young age.
 
prikoke said:
Boxing IMO. Look at fighters like Lawler, JDS, Gus. They were able to learn enough TDD to keep top level wrestlers like Hendricks, Cain and Jones from taking them down and keeping them down.
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The only reason Lawler is in MMA is because Miletich came to his high school wrestling practices bro
 
In terms of an art, that realistically would be Combat Sambo, done nogi, which does happen. Sambo is such a niche sport to begin with though. Less people do Sambo compared to Folk/freestyle Wrestling or BJJ, at least in the US, so those sports would have one advantage over it in the sense that you're more likely to have a very deep pool of sparring partners, which is NEVER a bad thing.
 
folk style wrestling.
personally i am very fascinated by catch wrestling too, a style that i have to admit i don't know very well because here there aren't dedicated school at all.

also for the stand up it's 'better' go straight to muay thai\k-1 than boxing, if the school is legit they can easily help you to develop a good boxing's arsenal too.

bjj, obviously, i can't say if catch wrestling is a good surrogate because, as i said, i don't know it very well.
 
Wrestling is the best base, it's also the most physically challenging so you develop strength, explosive movement, toughness, etc.
 
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