Are school shootings simply the result of capitalism?

[hillelslovak87]

you named people who weren't even shooters dummy.

Crazy right wing nutjobs who blew people up, shot people up. Did so for the same fucking insane reasons. Something makes me think you find nothing to quibble about when the perpetrators happen to be of a specific religious group.

I wrote mass shooters, you then made the claim that all in history were registered democrat, save one. I mean. This does not even pass the smell test, is is so impoverished an insinuation.

So, since you asserted that except for one, mass shooters have been registered democrats. Let us find a few examples to explode your assertion, shall we?

Benjamin Nathaniel Smith, 1999. Neo Nazi, kills 2, wounds 9 other non whites. Something tells me he was not a democrat.

Richard Baumhammers, 2000. ranting about non white immigration kills 5 people in Pittsburgh.

Jim David Adkisson, 2008. Specifically targets liberals or democrats, opens fire at a Unitarian Church in Tennessee, kills 2.

Richard Andrew Poplawski, 2009. Stormfront obsessed, paranoid about Obama gun ban, kills three officers.

Wade Michael Page, 2012. Opens fire at a Sikh Temple in Wisconsin, killing 6. Those pesky liberals, always opening fire on Sikhs!!!!

Dylann Roof, 2015. Opens fire, killing 9 in a Black Church in South Carolina. Roof was obsessed with white supremacy. Probably not a democrat.

John Russell Houser, 2015. Opens fire at a screening of Trainwreck, killing two women.

Robert Lewis Dear, 2015. Religious fanatic opens fire at an abortion clinic in Colorado, killing 3.

I guess, we got it all wrong, and these few examples were all democrats, proving your right.

 

[Tiny]

So you're saying that you shouldn't ban guns because people will just use something?

If other weapons are just as effective as guns then why are guns always being used? Why do soldiers use guns? Swords and knives kill too.... why don't soldiers and police use them instead?




And actually, they've worked on fixing that whole truck into crowds things

You could call it truck control.

Its unfortunate that those do not appear everywhere.

What im saying to you is that you are avoiding the actual problem.

 

[PEDS Help me Post]

Its unfortunate that those do not appear everywhere.

What im saying to you is that you are avoiding the actual problem.

And what's the actual problem?

 

[Tiny]

And what's the actual problem?

Why more and more people feel the need to kill lots of people?

I dont know. But its gotten worse and all we seem to focus in on is how they do it.

 

[PEDS Help me Post]

Why more and more people feel the need to kill lots of people?

I dont know. But its gotten worse and all we seem to focus in on is how they do it.

It would seem that banning guns would be far more achievable than basically overhauling your entire culture and mass deprogramming your populace, wouldn't it?

 

[JoeRoganade]

I made this post in the Florida thread, and thought maybe it deserved it's own.

I'm pretty sure that it is a widely accepted fact that while household firearm ownership has been dropping, gun sales have been up in the last 30+ years because fewer people are stockpiling more and more weapons than they used to. I have seen arguments that this was the result of a marketing campaign by the gun industry (in response to falling household ownership (profits) in the 70's) to target their hardcore buyers by offering more options, interchangeable parts, colors, specialty guns, etc., creating a fetish of sorts.

I don't think anyone would disagree that we live in a hyper-consumeristic society, and, along with social media and the Internet, ultimately leads us to shorter and shorter attention spans. I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that this would then result in a much higher prevalence of compulsive behaviors. These people then seek treatment, and voila, we have a significant portion of the population on psychotropic medications.

You now have a portion of the population who are big time gun enthusiasts/borderline fetishists, have 2-second attention spans, are OCD, and on some kind of behavior altering medications.

Whether it's romanticizing guns in Soldier of Fortune magazines, adding a new colorful handle for the "sport shooting" crowd, Doctors prescribing meds, pharma corporations pushing those meds, or consumerism in general, it's all driven by the desire to improve the bottom line. Capitalism.

So is capitalism partly to blame?

The media is to blame as they promote and practically turn shooters into celebrities. Don't contribute to it by falling for their click bait. The media is essentially profiting off of this stuff.

 

[Scrody]

Crazy right wing nutjobs who blew people up, shot people up. Did so for the same fucking insane reasons. Something makes me think you find nothing to quibble about when the perpetrators happen to be of a specific religious group.

I wrote mass shooters, you then made the claim that all in history were registered democrat, save one. I mean. This does not even pass the smell test, is is so impoverished an insinuation.

So, since you asserted that except for one, mass shooters have been registered democrats. Let us find a few examples to explode your assertion, shall we?

Benjamin Nathaniel Smith, 1999. Neo Nazi, kills 2, wounds 9 other non whites. Something tells me he was not a democrat.

Richard Baumhammers, 2000. ranting about non white immigration kills 5 people in Pittsburgh.

Jim David Adkisson, 2008. Specifically targets liberals or democrats, opens fire at a Unitarian Church in Tennessee, kills 2.

Richard Andrew Poplawski, 2009. Stormfront obsessed, paranoid about Obama gun ban, kills three officers.

Wade Michael Page, 2012. Opens fire at a Sikh Temple in Wisconsin, killing 6. Those pesky liberals, always opening fire on Sikhs!!!!

Dylann Roof, 2015. Opens fire, killing 9 in a Black Church in South Carolina. Roof was obsessed with white supremacy. Probably not a democrat.

John Russell Houser, 2015. Opens fire at a screening of Trainwreck, killing two women.

Robert Lewis Dear, 2015. Religious fanatic opens fire at an abortion clinic in Colorado, killing 3.

I guess, we got it all wrong, and these few examples were all democrats, proving your right.

Don't forget about Omar! Killed 50 people at a nightclub. Hillary supporter. San Bernardino didn't strike me as a republican attack. Guy who opened up on the republicans playing basketball or whatever. The Dallas shooter who killed five cops. It's not exclusive one way or the other. Nutjobs gonna nutjob.

 

[Judge]

I made this post in the Florida thread, and thought maybe it deserved it's own.

I'm pretty sure that it is a widely accepted fact that while household firearm ownership has been dropping, gun sales have been up in the last 30+ years because fewer people are stockpiling more and more weapons than they used to. I have seen arguments that this was the result of a marketing campaign by the gun industry (in response to falling household ownership (profits) in the 70's) to target their hardcore buyers by offering more options, interchangeable parts, colors, specialty guns, etc., creating a fetish of sorts.

I don't think anyone would disagree that we live in a hyper-consumeristic society, and, along with social media and the Internet, ultimately leads us to shorter and shorter attention spans. I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that this would then result in a much higher prevalence of compulsive behaviors. These people then seek treatment, and voila, we have a significant portion of the population on psychotropic medications.

You now have a portion of the population who are big time gun enthusiasts/borderline fetishists, have 2-second attention spans, are OCD, and on some kind of behavior altering medications.

Whether it's romanticizing guns in Soldier of Fortune magazines, adding a new colorful handle for the "sport shooting" crowd, Doctors prescribing meds, pharma corporations pushing those meds, or consumerism in general, it's all driven by the desire to improve the bottom line. Capitalism.

So is capitalism partly to blame?

Are genocides simply the result of socialism?

 

[Tiny]

It would seem that banning guns would be far more achievable than basically overhauling your entire culture and mass deprogramming your populace, wouldn't it?

Except people who want to fucking kill will do so regardless if their is a ban on guns.

Oh... do you think in their insanity “shit im not allowed to do what im doing!”

“I cant use that truck!, i dont have my license!” Or “Im not legally
Allowed to own this gun...i better go turn myself in!”.

You cant achieve that goal so you better start asking the harder questions...and get answers

 

[MacDuffle]

And what's the actual problem?

Extension?

Criminality is processed on a case by case basis

We apply extensions to that criminal and we get a demographic in our sights, geographical, ethnic, religious, political previous history, you name it, and we complain up the chains of command that those people are dangerous and must be limited in their existence among us. That runs a pretty steep tab of a bunch of problems related to projecting future criminals in certain types of human

When we don't apply extensions to people we blame the equipment used in the crime

That has met with mixed results, we do actually cite burglary tools and unsecured firearms and vehicular weaponry restrictions and state laws on carry policy and ownership

Whether you want to get mad at "all people like ___" or all weapons like ____" you're bound to leave the straight and narrow context between a criminal case and that specific case's subject/defendant. So your future legislation may run into logical proofs for their necessity, be they pro or anti-gun following a shooting. You've extended the case data to minority-report prevent future crimes. Not a bad impulse to fight preemptively against crime, just tough to prove its shape with case evidence that is supposed to be individual in legal theory

 

[Neph]

I don't think drugs have anything to do with it.

Some people have pointed out that the kid has facial features characteristic of children born with foetal alcohol syndrome. He was an adoption too, he probably had a rough early years of life before being taken away by child services. Poor early years have far-reaching consequences on brain development and normal functioning. Then after being adopted, his adoptive father died. This kid's nature and nurture was fucked up from the start.

That seems highly speculative to view a young adults face and determine if he/she had foetal alcohol syndrome.

I would also caution about any explanation that involves things that you may feel are out of your control. It is probably a comforting explanation that allows you to say 'there's nothing we could have done' but the reality is:
1) Just about every country has drinking issues (hell I'm Australian, we have a big problem in our drinking culture) and have children with foetal alcohol syndrome
2) Every country has children brought up in poor circumstances
3) Only America has mass shootings in this scale

What I'm trying to say is the characteristics you are pointing out, if they are true at all, are common across every country. So I don't believe it is an adequate explanation to why school shootings only happen with this regularity in America.

 

[PEDS Help me Post]

Except people who want to fucking kill will do so regardless if their is a ban on guns.

Oh... do you think in their insanity “shit im not allowed to do what im doing!”

“I cant use that truck!, i dont have my license!” Or “Im not legally
Allowed to own this gun...i better go turn myself in!”.

You cant achieve that goal so you better start asking the harder questions...and get answers

So you're basically back to saying that guns shouldn't be banned because there's other tools out there that they could use if they wanted to kill people and ignoring the fact that the entire purpose of a gun is to make killing people quicker and easier..... which is the exact reason it is used by soldiers in war and policemen in the line of duty.


Also, you seem to like bringing up truck attacks..... how many truck attacks have there been in the United States?

 

[silicavaginitis]

The pussification of the United States.

 

[Tiny]

So you're basically back to saying that guns shouldn't be banned because there's other tools out there that they could use if they wanted to kill people and ignoring the fact that the entire purpose of a gun is to make killing people quicker and easier..... which is the exact reason it is used by soldiers in war and policemen in the line of duty.


Also, you seem to like bringing up truck attacks..... how many truck attacks have there been in the United States?

I'm saying it's not going to solve the fucking problem. Their's a difference there.

Way too much focus is going towards the method and not enough towards the motivation.

 

[PEDS Help me Post]

I'm saying it's not going to solve the fucking problem. Their's a difference there.

Way too much focus is going towards the method and not enough towards the motivation.

So if you can't solve the problem then you shouldn't even bother trying to limit the damage?

Why bother putting murderers in jail then... it's not stopping murder. You might as well let them go ahead until you find their motivation, right?

 

[Neph]

I'm saying it's not going to solve the fucking problem. Their's a difference there.

Way too much focus is going towards the method and not enough towards the motivation.

I mean it's pretty clear that if you want to kill people guns are a pretty good way of doing it. It's hard to go mass murder people with knives and, while creative ways will always exist, each time you make one way more difficult you reduce (but not eliminate) the chances of another catastrophe.

Clearly the motivation is the biggest problem but that's not reason enough to reduce the methodology.

 

[Tiny]

I mean it's pretty clear that if you want to kill people guns are a pretty good way of doing it. It's hard to go mass murder people with knives and, while creative ways will always exist, each time you make one way more difficult you reduce (but not eliminate) the chances of another catastrophe.

Clearly the motivation is the biggest problem but that's not reason enough to reduce the methodology.

Yes because their are not a vast amount of better ways to kill someone without guns...its instantly down to knives...IN THIS DAY AND AGE.

And that's if we ignore the fact that criminals generally dont obey any kind of laws...

"oh theirs a ban on this type of gun...SHIT I guess I wont go shoot up that school then!"

 

[silicavaginitis]

True fact...rifles kill less people than blunt objects.
Carpenters...watch your back,they might be coming for your hammers

 

[Neph]

Yes because their are not a vast amount of better ways to kill someone without guns...its instantly down to knives...IN THIS DAY AND AGE.

And that's if we ignore the fact that criminals generally dont obey any kind of laws...

I hate to say it but this is a very black and white view of things that doesn't reflect the truth.

Guns are incredibly effective and easy to get, that's why you see them used so often. As you take away highly effective implements you leave people with less effective ones and it reduces the capacity to kill. It's all pretty obvious to me? For the same reason that if high powered explosives were so easy to obtain you would see them used more frequently... well... they aren't easy to obtain, they are very strongly controlled.

In addition it is simply untrue that 'criminals generally don't obey any kind of laws'. I think you'll find that the situation is a little more nuanced than that, otherwise every criminal would be a baby raping terrorist-inspired financial fraudster. People are complicated, and there are laws for a damn good reason.

 

[Neph]

True fact...rifles kill less people than blunt objects.
Carpenters...watch your back,they might be coming for your hammers

...really, that's what you have to say?