Angles for Southpaw vs Orthodox

[Higus]

Warning: this is a bit of a novel, but I hope you like it anyway. Some people were asking about footwork in the Southpaw (SP) vs Orthodox (OD) match up, so I decided to break down some of the angles with diagrams and even a few sexy gifs. Sinister made an excellent tread on related topics recently, so I thought I would try to build on it with some stuff that I was already working on. This isn’t specifically so much about footwork as it is about angles and ring generalship.

This is the SP vs OD neutral angle.

In the OD vs OD match up, a common technique is to attain a dominant angle by circling to the right since it puts you away from your opponent’s cross. In the SP vs OD match up, the idea is the same, but the direction is different. OD will move to his left and SP will move to his right.

Since the opponent isn’t going to just stand there and let his opponent circle, he’ll try to circle with the opponent to try to regain a neutral angle (below left) or to cut off the corner and achieve the better angle (below right).

Sometimes, it becomes a game of cat and mouse, with the fighter on the in the center chasing the fighter on the outside. When it becomes a circling contest, the fighter on the inside has the advantage because he has less distance to travel in the same amount of time when trying to outmaneuver his opponent.

This is why “controlling the center of the ring/cage” is an important strategy for some fighters.

 

[Higus]

Now imagine you know your opponent is trying to follow you or cut you off. If you know where he is trying to be, you can anticipate it and use it to your advantage. After circling to the outside a few times, you see that he is following you. With a sudden direction change, you are now in a position where you can strike and he can’t retaliate. If you’ve set it up well by really making your opponent chase after you, he’ll have too much momentum in his direction to do anything other than block. He’ll lose a valuable moment trying to adjust himself back to neutral while you are on the attack. The change in rhythm when you explode on the inside will also catch him off guard.

In the diagram, even though you are on the inside, you are still at an angle that his power hand cannot effectively get you. As far as footwork for getting on the inside, just use the foot work found here: http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f11/basic-footwork-technique-beginners-1588633/index4.html#post51940949. In the OD vs OD stance, the technique brought you to the outside of your opponent, but in a SP vs OD situation, it will take you on the inside. If you are SP, just exchange the left and rights and you will do the same step in the opposite direction.

Although its risker, you can also try to hop the angle instead of stepping it. It’s generally not a good idea to let both feet leave the ground, but it’s ok to break the rules every now and then if you know when you can get away with it. Here are examples of Machida fighting from the inside angle using a hop.

When circling outside, he moves his right leg out first, then slides the left after it. When executing the direction change, he gets his weight on his right leg, but then springs off in the opposite direction instead of sliding his left leg after. He has all his weight loaded on his left leg when he lands, which sets him up perfectly for his best weapon: the straight left. Notice that in both gifs his opponents have to turn back towards him once he changes directions. There is both a positional as well as a mental reset his opponents go through once he changes direction, which Machida takes full advantage of. You can practice this with a partner either holding mitts and moving with you, or by taking turns blocking and hitting. 1-2-angle in-2 is a good combo to practice

 

[FaceEraser]

As a southpaw myself, I love these! I like the last one you did, this one even more. It's tough getting little pointers like this being 1 of only 2 SPs in my gym. Gonna work on this monday.

 

[krnguy03]

Awesome post man, I too am a Southpaw and it's nice to see diagrams of the different angles.

 

[Boxer123]

Another (real) southpaw here, loving the diagrams dude! lol.

 

[AussieLethwei]

Thanks Higus!

 

[Snubnoze707]

Great thread. I've been sparring against southpaws since the start so this subject has always been an interest of mine. I think this kind of inside information that most southpaws realize and most orthodox are unaware of is a good explanation for there being so many dominate southpaw in striking sports. Most of my favorite strikers are southpaw, so its pretty neat to pick up on some of the tricks they use to exploit an orthodox fighter, and turn that around against the southpaw.

Although its risker, you can also try to hop the angle instead of stepping it. It’s generally not a good idea to let both feet leave the ground, but it’s ok to break the rules every now and then if you know when you can get away with it.

It's more of a shuffle than a hop, but here's Kickboxing's P4P and southpaw Giorgio Petrosyan practicing this on the pads at 1:19

 

[Fire of Youth]

Great little tutorial there. It was clear, concise and informative. I just would like to add an extra benefit when you step inside (post #2); you can catch them flat footed. So even if they block your attack, they will most likely be pushed back off balance. You can then launch your follow up attacks with the aim of capitalising on their lack of balance.

 

[EasternWind]

Thanks guys, this gives me things to work on.

 

[Boricuajj]

Amazing post. You could not have posted this at a better time.

I am the only southpaw at my gym, and we were working angles. I was kinda left with the whole "Just switch rights and lefts, and it's the same." Explanation, which didn't help a whole lot (I'm not a very good striker). But after reading this, it makes so much more sense.

Thank you!

 

[Charlitos1988]

please Hogus, do the same graphics explaining Machida footwork.

 

[Discipulus]

Good work, man.

Michael Johnson recently destroyed Joe Lauzon by circling to the right (Johnson's the southpaw) and then cutting back to the inside. Lauzon would get caught overcommitting in his attempt to prevent Lauzon from getting his foot outside, and he'd eat some hard punches from that inside angle.

Edit: Snubnoze, you're onto something there. I think the biggest advantage most southpaws have is that orthodox fighters think they know how to fight a southpaw fighter, but don't really understand the concept. "Beat the foot" is good advice in a sense, but it fails to capture the real goal of fighting a southpaw which is, of course, to attack their center line from an angle.

 

[JayElectra]

Good work, man.

Michael Johnson recently destroyed Joe Lauzon by circling to the right (Johnson's the southpaw) and then cutting back to the inside. Lauzon would get caught overcommitting in his attempt to prevent Lauzon from getting his foot outside, and he'd eat some hard punches from that inside angle.


Edit: Snubnoze, you're onto something there. I think the biggest advantage most southpaws have is that orthodox fighters think they know how to fight a southpaw fighter, but don't really understand the concept. "Beat the foot" is good advice in a sense, but it fails to capture the real goal of fighting a southpaw which is, of course, to attack their center line from an angle.

I love the Johnson example, and I loved that fight. Something tells me that Pedro Diaz's inclusion into the Blackzillian camp had at least something to do with Johnson looking so sharp. It is a significant point that merely getting the lead foot outside of your opponent's lead foot is not the be all end all of fighting a southpaw (or vice versa). It's only about half the battle. One great example of a southpaw securing the proper angle and making great use of the position was Nunn v. Kalambay. Many call the KO something of a fluke and you could say it was a bit of an aberration considering Sumbu's quality and the fact that Nunn wasn't really known for his one punch KO power, but the actual KO was a result of some brilliant footwork on Nunn's part.



An example of terrible footwork hurting a fighter against a southpaw is Kongo v. Mir. Mir does well to maneuver himself into an advantageous position, originally, but from there Kongo puts himself into an even worse position by completely squaring himself up. Mir has Kongo completely vulnerable and proceeds to knock him down and submit him. Now, the threat of the takedown played a part, but it doesn't explain Kongo's complete and utter lack of awareness against a southpaw.

 

[sboone**]

Sexy.

Chopped him down like a boss.

Notice how Mir used the right hand to feint.

To the boxing experts here: Do you consider Mir's use of bringing his head in any good? Or did he hunch forward too much?
I prefer to keep my head close to my right shoulder.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Another note here is the subtlety of creating angles. I like to sort of drift and make small corrections that give an illusion of my range and intentions, as well as making my opponent think we're squared up when in fact I've got the edge

 

[Discipulus]

I love the Johnson example, and I loved that fight. Something tells me that Pedro Diaz's inclusion into the Blackzillian camp had at least something to do with Johnson looking so sharp. It is a significant point that merely getting the lead foot outside of your opponent's lead foot is not the be all end all of fighting a southpaw (or vice versa). It's only about half the battle. One great example of a southpaw securing the proper angle and making great use of the position was Nunn v. Kalambay. Many call the KO something of a fluke and you could say it was a bit of an aberration considering Sumbu's quality and the fact that Nunn wasn't really known for his one punch KO power, but the actual KO was a result of some brilliant footwork on Nunn's part.



An example of terrible footwork hurting a fighter against a southpaw is Kongo v. Mir. Mir does well to maneuver himself into an advantageous position, originally, but from there Kongo puts himself into an even worse position by completely squaring himself up. Mir has Kongo completely vulnerable and proceeds to knock him down and submit him. Now, the threat of the takedown played a part, but it doesn't explain Kongo's complete and utter lack of awareness against a southpaw.

Wow, I'm loving the footwork in that Nunn-Kalambay fight. First time I've seen that one.

It really reminds me of Marquez-Pacquiao IV. Nunn got Kalambay to really commit to chasing him with the jab, and the man basically did Nunn's work for him. He just overextended while Nunn stepped to the outside, and that was that. The only difference between this and the Marquez fight is that it only took Nunn a minute and a half. Killer.

Sexy.

Chopped him down like a boss.

Notice how Mir used the right hand to feint.

To the boxing experts here: Do you consider Mir's use of bringing his head in any good? Or did he hunch forward too much?
I prefer to keep my head close to my right shoulder.

It's a pretty awful punch, technically speaking. Elbow way up, back foot way behind, head way forward. Kongo did most of Mir's work for him there. Bafflingly bad footwork on Kongo's part.

 

[JayElectra]

Wow, I'm loving the footwork in that Nunn-Kalambay fight. First time I've seen that one.

It really reminds me of Marquez-Pacquiao IV. Nunn got Kalambay to really commit to chasing him with the jab, and the man basically did Nunn's work for him. He just overextended while Nunn stepped to the outside, and that was that. The only difference between this and the Marquez fight is that it only took Nunn a minute and a half. Killer.

I've actually been trying to decide whether it is more Kalambay stepping his lead foot inside too far and over-committing to the jab, or Nunn maneuvering himself into the great position. It is certainly a bit of both, but more of the former, likely. Nunn was a such a wasted talent.

 

[hell wall]

Sherdog demands more posts from higus... also could u make a video demo of the techniques