A Forbes Public Service Announcement: The 17 Most Useless College Majors (Avoid! Avoid! Avoid!)

[luckyshot]

lol @ exercise scientist!

Not sure I agree with all the teacher positions on that list. In Ontario a teacher will earn $80k+, 3 months off, 6.5 hour work day, solid gold pension and benefits.

Canadian teachers are paid better than US teachers, on average, but most of them still don't make what you claim.

Anyone who thinks a 25 year-old kid is going to get a teaching gig and make $80k in US dollars is wrong.

Canadian secondary teachers wages, averaging $66,700 [about 50k USD] are the fourth highest internationally, after Germany, Luxembourg and the Netherlands.

Teachers in Ontario recently ratified three-year tentative agreements that include a 1.5 per cent pay increase over the life of the contract. In Toronto, elementary teachers currently begin their careers earning $42,283 to $55,404, up to a maximum of $94,707 (all figures Canadian) — or roughly $71,000 U.S. — after 10 years.

https://www.thestar.com/yourtoronto...ers-among-top-paid-worldwide-study-finds.html

 

[IDL]

There are way more jobs in art history than people might realize. You just gotta be willing to move around for em.

I don't think it's true that you'd have to move, because there are Starbucks everywhere

 

[S Class]

Im a chemistry major... I really hope I can find a job after college without having to do more school.

I suggest you go to Pharmacy school and get that Anderson Silva money

 

[luckyshot]

I totally agree that it's not a 1:1 transition unless you plan to increase output at an exponential rate.

Like I said in my post, the economy will be getting even more cutthroat, and no one can stop it. That's just the path that civilization is taking, and it's bigger than you, me, and the United States government. You can either scramble to get in with the "haves" or you can rot with the "have nots." In the end, the choice is up to each of us.

I agree with the premise but not that your conclusion is necessary. Europe has had a very wealthy and equitable society since the end of the second World War, so it can be done. But, yes, it will require embracing more socialistic principles.

We've already seen populism (however misguided) explode out of seemingly nowhere in the US and UK. If that populism gets channeled in the direction of socialistic principles we could see a drastic change in the course of things.

#feelthebern

 

[HunterSdVa29]

it'd be interesting to see this compared to some Vocational Trades/Certs...

LIke average salary of a Liberal Arts Major vs a HVAC tech....

or ASE master tech Mechanic versus a Social Sciences degree?

why our country seems to push/prefer higher education while simultaneously looking down on trades and vocations is beyond me
then again, it's probably why I can change the oil in my car and not much else haha

 

[Breakfast Bar]

I wonder what's behind the low ranking of educators/teachers. It seems like there is a steady and significant need for them; maybe it's the fact that they self-report as under-appreciated more than other majors, despite finding work just as easily? Or maybe it's the fact that they are moving into a powerful union where the top spots are all taken and so they have to settle for districts that they don't like or substituting?


Also surprised not to see the usual culprits of ethnic and women's studies or Xth century literature on there. I'd expect those to have a lot of idealistic appeal to young people but very few positions that need to be filled in the real world economy, similar to art history.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

They said they were desperate for them, but to even interview, you have to already be coming here on your own and give them your flight info 2 months in advance before they'll even schedule the interview. Basically, they claim to need teachers but it's limited to people who are doing well enough in their own places to afford Hawaiian vacations but still would like to pack up their shit and move to an expensive island in the middle of the ocean for a teacher's salary in a place that's known to have really shit public schools.

I guess they're the cause of their own shortage with their "common sense" regulations.

 

[Fawlty]

it'd be interesting to see this compared to some Vocational Trades/Certs...

LIke average salary of a Liberal Arts Major vs a HVAC tech....

or ASE master tech Mechanic versus a Social Sciences degree?

why our country seems to push/prefer higher education while simultaneously looking down on trades and vocations is beyond me
then again, it's probably why I can change the oil in my car and not much else haha

Isn't the trend going the other way as far as looking down on trades? More vocational schools and federal money under both Bush & Obama, and with respect declining for social science & parts of humanities, people saying "learn a trade" is more common today than I remember 20 years ago.

 

[sub_thug]

I agree with the premise but not that your conclusion is necessary. Europe has had a very wealthy and equitable society since the end of the second World War, so it can be done. But, yes, it will require embracing more socialistic principles.

We've already seen populism (however misguided) explode out of seemingly nowhere in the US and UK. If that populism gets channeled in the direction of socialistic principles we could see a drastic change in the course of things.

#feelthebern

I don't look at Europe and see a model that I want to emulate. At all. Assuming that I did, however, I am not convinced that such a large, heterogeneous population with so many different regional economies could replicate that model here. To me, socialism is the easy and idealistic answer that won't actually work for any of us when implemented. I just see us all becoming poor and miserable together.

Populism is just a sign of the times. I think a lot of people are feeling like they don't have the opportunities that they feel they deserve, and there is a reaction to prevailing narratives that exist in the media and popular culture. As I talk to people, I find that people are more frustrated that they are generalized and feel controlled by forces that they don't approve of. Rather than be stuck inside a box, they intend to rip that box apart. Donald Trump and his message are a symptom of that, so if you want to get rid of him and the beliefs that he espouses, we need to be serious about creating opportunities for people who feel like the world is passing them by.

I feel the way that I feel about college education because I refuse to be left behind. Even if I have to claw myself there inch by inch, I want to be successful. I'm moonlighting these days as a cybersecurity engineer because my day job as an army officer isn't enough. I'm laying the groundwork to start my own company, build my own software product, and attempt to make some of the money that is circulating in that industry. My time spent fighting in 3rd world shit holes has taught me a valuable lesson that I am eternally grateful for: If you are constantly looking for an edge, you will be killed. That lesson applies perfectly to business.

 

[Brodels]

Not using my major but still thankful it's not on there.

 

[luckyshot]

Populism is just a sign of the times. I think a lot of people are feeling like they don't have the opportunities that they feel they deserve, and there is a reaction to prevailing narratives that exist in the media and popular culture. As I talk to people, I find that people are more frustrated that they are generalized and feel controlled by forces that they don't approve of. Rather than be stuck inside a box, they intend to rip that box apart. Donald Trump and his message are a symptom of that, so if you want to get rid of him and the beliefs that he espouses, we need to be serious about creating opportunities for people who feel like the world is passing them by.

In your previous posts you described a "increasingly more cutthroat economy" where 90% of the population is going to be left behind because of economic realities that are "larger than any of us or even the US government."

There is a lot of contradiction between that fatalistic idea and the "pick yourself up by the bootstraps" entrepreneurial thinking you are praising in the post I just quoted.

What kind of opportunities do you see people creating when 90% of the population is destined to fail?

How can you describe a world where 90% of the people are destined to fail as "populism"?

"Most people are going to fail, but I am going succeed," is only populism for people who are very bad at math.

Which probably describes Trump's base to a T.

Also, you might not personally see Europe as model you want to emulate, but if your prediction of 90% of the population living as economic failures comes true, I think a lot of voters will disagree.

There is a reason why Bernie is so popular with young voters, and it's not because they are tired of all the great economic opportunities available to them.

 

[WalkenWouldOwn]

@Madmick , didn't you go to school for something in the top 10 of that list? Or am I remembering wrong?

 

[SwamiLeoni]

Project Manager makes sense. You don't need a degree in it because you can get certified in it later in your career. And frankly being a project manager is going to be industry specific anyway.

I'm a certified project manager because I wanted to treat legal work like projects and bill them differently. Being certified made it easier to understand how to do it. Plus it helps with my project based clients when I draft their contracts.

My boy is a chemical engineer and he's a project manager for an oil company since part of his job is overseeing the constructing of oil rigs. No generic project manager degree is going to substitute the need for the baseline education in a specific field before you can apply project management skills to it.

I work in the Aerospace industry in a position that isn’t technical (I.E. Quality / Engineering ect). I do however manage company and customer property and work on many large projects. I don’t have a Project Management certificate but I’m starting to understand the basics of how to run one. My manager is really pushing me to get my PMP and I think I’m going to do it this year. I just took a 3 day course (Project Management Essentials) and I thought it was great. 40% of my job is to maintain our groups Continuous Improvement metrics. Although CI & PM aren’t the same thing, they seem to use many of the same tools (Risk Management, Process Maps, Schedules, OTD ect). The instructor told me that 40% of the PMP test isn’t in the PMBOK, is that true? I’ve heard it’s a somewhat difficult test and I’m terrible with memorization.

 

[WorldofWarcraft]

Isn't the trend going the other way as far as looking down on trades? More vocational schools and federal money under both Bush & Obama, and with respect declining for social science & parts of humanities, people saying "learn a trade" is more common today than I remember 20 years ago.

There's a very large age gap in the trades. I'm deeply connected in the social circle of the big trades and we're hurting for EXPERIENCED people. We have to fly in chiller technicians from NYC all the way to Vegas, then they fly to Hawaii the very next day. There's that much of an age/experience gap. People look down on trades, but there's a shitload of money to be made depending on which trade you settle with. Not to mention, union power and pensions plus side jobs, which a lot of tradesmen get much of their money from.

 

[Gregolian]

Spend 4 years to get a Paralegal degree? LOL, whoever does that deserves to not make cash. I earned my certificate in 1 year after getting a 4 year in something else and people that want a paralegal "degree" that is the same as my certificate can get it in two at a damn CC.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

17 College Majors That Report Higher Underemployment
Don't be tricked into allowing yourself to believe that you can be a useless human being and still have enough value to feel safe or secure in that decision. Don't try to save the world. You end up useless that way. Look out for #1. Reject more profitable careers only if you find them personally intolerable as a day-to-day burden.

Some of these are obviously useful, such as "Criminal Justice worker", "Health Care Administrator" and "Educator", but the reason they're showing up is that they have become overpopulated with too many useless people, and are therefore less likely to want you.

That's it. Those are my "words of wisdom" to Generation Z Sherdoggers. They probably lack wisdom, but that doesn't make them wrong.

1. P.E. (Physical Education) Teacher
   
2. Human Services (i.e. social service workers)
   
3. Illustrator
4. Criminal Justice worker
   
5. Project Manager*
6. Radio/Television & Film Producer
7. Studio Artist
8. Health Care Administrator
9. Educator (i.e. Teacher)
   
10. Human Development & Family Studies (i.e. more social service workers)
    
11. Creative Writing (i.e. Writer)
    
12. Animal Scientist
13. Exercise Scientist (i.e. Personal Trainer)
    
14. Health Scientist
15. Paralegal
    
16. Theatre (i.e. Actor/Actress/Playwright/etc.)
    
17. Art Historian

*This is the only one that sticks out because I swear I'd seen this recently on some "Most Profitable" lists. Maybe it's hard to find a job, but once you do, it puts you in the 1%. Same situation faced by the big hitters in the "Health Care Administrator" field.

Just get the Project Msnagemrnt certification and slap it on your resume = profit$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[Shoemaker]

17 College Majors That Report Higher Underemployment
Don't be tricked into allowing yourself to believe that you can be a useless human being and still have enough value to feel safe or secure in that decision. Don't try to save the world. You end up useless that way. Look out for #1. Reject more profitable careers only if you find them personally intolerable as a day-to-day burden.

Some of these are obviously useful, such as "Criminal Justice worker", "Health Care Administrator" and "Educator", but the reason they're showing up is that they have become overpopulated with too many useless people, and are therefore less likely to want you.

That's it. Those are my "words of wisdom" to Generation Z Sherdoggers. They probably lack wisdom, but that doesn't make them wrong.

1. P.E. (Physical Education) Teacher
   
2. Human Services (i.e. social service workers)
   
3. Illustrator
4. Criminal Justice worker
   
5. Project Manager*
6. Radio/Television & Film Producer
7. Studio Artist
8. Health Care Administrator
9. Educator (i.e. Teacher)
   
10. Human Development & Family Studies (i.e. more social service workers)
    
11. Creative Writing (i.e. Writer)
    
12. Animal Scientist
13. Exercise Scientist (i.e. Personal Trainer)
    
14. Health Scientist
15. Paralegal
    
16. Theatre (i.e. Actor/Actress/Playwright/etc.)
    
17. Art Historian

*This is the only one that sticks out because I swear I'd seen this recently on some "Most Profitable" lists. Maybe it's hard to find a job, but once you do, it puts you in the 1%. Same situation faced by the big hitters in the "Health Care Administrator" field.

Regarding Project Management, I think it's a hard thing to get into because of a degree. I'm a programmer, and a lot of PMs I know either worked at their respective companies for a long time and had a firm understanding of the product and the tools the company uses, or they had a background in programming themselves. But I've never seen someone entry-level get hired into it. They do other things, and then become pm.

That's my experience in the software industry anyway.

 

[Shoemaker]

Ahh @Falsedawn beat me to it.

 

[sub_thug]

In your previous posts you described a "increasingly more cutthroat economy" where 90% of the population is going to be left behind because of economic realities that are "larger than any of us or even the US government."

There is a lot of contradiction between that fatalistic idea and the "pick yourself up by the bootstraps" entrepreneurial thinking you are praising in the post I just quoted.

What kind of opportunities do you see people creating when 90% of the population is destined to fail?

How can you describe a world where 90% of the people are destined to fail as "populism"?

"Most people are going to fail, but I am going succeed," is only populism for people who are very bad at math.

Which probably describes Trump's base to a T.

I never said it would be easy, but I think that's the way it's going to go. I guess the analogy is that you can get on one of those last few shuttles out, or you will be left behind to perish. Accepting that mentality, if I were you, I'd start running as fast as my legs could carry me towards that launch pad. Put another way, we have all been dumped into the middle of the North Atlantic, and the lifeboats can only hold so many. Start swimming, climb over people if you have to, but if you don't get there, you won't survive in the future. Yes, it's bleak, but that's the way I see it. I don't think that economic stratification is going to halt any time soon, so it would behoove anyone to get on the winning side of the economic elite. It's a long shot, but it's the only shot if you don't want to be one of the poor masses. You can try and convince me all day that Bernie Sanders and his lot are going to save us from my dystopian view of the future, but I don't buy it. Even if you could manage to get someone like that elected, I don't think you could get the legislative or judicial backing to get anything done. Bernie Sanders is a house cat at the end of the day, and you'll never have the kind of support you'd need to make his vision a reality. President Obama (I think it's not really fair to call Presidents Clinton and Carter true liberals, as they were more moderates than anything) was the only true liberal that has held the presidency in my lifetime, and not even he could deliver the kinds of social programming that you'd need to pull it off. Of course, the rest of the world will influence things as well, and I see them making things worse for us, not better.

The opportunities are out there though. I think many of them will be based in technology, although finance is another good option for those who have those gifts. Other things will require more start-up capital, but that means finding angel investors and series-round bargaining that can destroy a company just as easily as a bad product or imperfect timing. For people to take advantage of those things, they will need to be exceptionally gifted and hard-working, but that's just the way it goes.

 

[luckyshot]

I never said it would be easy, but I think that's the way it's going to go. I guess the analogy is that you can get on one of those last few shuttles out, or you will be left behind to perish. Accepting that mentality, if I were you, I'd start running as fast as my legs could carry me towards that launch pad. Put another way, we have all been dumped into the middle of the North Atlantic, and the lifeboats can only hold so many. Start swimming, climb over people if you have to, but if you don't get there, you won't survive in the future. Yes, it's bleak, but that's the way I see it. I don't think that economic stratification is going to halt any time soon, so it would behoove anyone to get on the winning side of the economic elite. It's a long shot, but it's the only shot if you don't want to be one of the poor masses. You can try and convince me all day that Bernie Sanders and his lot are going to save us from my dystopian view of the future, but I don't buy it. Even if you could manage to get someone like that elected, I don't think you could get the legislative or judicial backing to get anything done. Bernie Sanders is a house cat at the end of the day, and you'll never have the kind of support you'd need to make his vision a reality. President Obama (I think it's not really fair to call Presidents Clinton and Carter true liberals, as they were more moderates than anything) was the only true liberal that has held the presidency in my lifetime, and not even he could deliver the kinds of social programming that you'd need to pull it off. Of course, the rest of the world will influence things as well, and I see them making things worse for us, not better.

The opportunities are out there though. I think many of them will be based in technology, although finance is another good option for those who have those gifts. Other things will require more start-up capital, but that means finding angel investors and series-round bargaining that can destroy a company just as easily as a bad product or imperfect timing. For people to take advantage of those things, they will need to be exceptionally gifted and hard-working, but that's just the way it goes.

OK- But how can you connect this vision to the populism that we've seen in the US and the UK?

Because populism is defined as "Support for the concerns of ordinary people" or "the quality of appealing to or being aimed at ordinary people."

Or, according to Wikipedia, "Populism is a political doctrine that proposes that the common people are exploited by a privileged elite, and which seeks to resolve this."

Do you think this moment of populism is just a flash in the pan that is going to fade?

Or do you think that people will continually be duped by the sort of false populism that someone like Trump offers?

I think this election told us that a lot of people are deeply unsatisfied and willing to go with pretty much anything besides the status quo.