Where do you rank Hatsu Hioki as a FW alltime?

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ExitLUPin

ExitLUPin

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the way i see his wins

Joe Pearson
Kadowaki
Niinimaki
Hominickx2 (top 10 1st time, top 5 the 2nd)
Curran (#2 FW in the world)
Sato
Kanehara (top 10)
Inoue (top 10)
Sandro (top 5)
Sanchez
Roop
Bart (top 10)
robbed against Guida (top 10 LW dropping down in debut)
Menjivar

- one of the best gurapplers in FW history, one of the most complete/well hounded too
- best guard passing game in FW history
- was a period from circa lat 06 to mid 07 after beating the #2 FW in the world in Curran, where ppl were talking about Hioki being the #1 FW in the world
- was top 5 in the world for different periods in his career, the one i mentioned earlier in his career but with Shoot/Sengoku SDs rankings changed often, skillwise he was top 5 for a while longer
- the other time many thought he was the #2 FW in the world but def top 5 from 2010-2012 when he won the Shooto FW belt from Inoue and the Sengoku FW belt from Sandro, two of the top 3-5 best FWs of that era
- was top 10 FW for sure from 06-12
- as bad as his UFC run was relative to his standing, he had already fought for nearly a decade and picked up decent wins. Plus even in losses

1. he had a gureat gurappling war with Aloe Vera, one of the best gurappling heavy fights of the year easily where he won the 1st
2. also took the 1st hound from Lamas and had a decently competitive 2nd too, but Lamas clearly took it and widely won the 3rd (tho not a 10-8 obivously)
3. also took the 1st hound against Elkins and had a very competitive 2nd hound too, small minority thinking he won it but i thought Elkins got it, then lost 3rd
4. won the 1st against Hooker and had his back/hurt him with a body kick but didnt have an answer for the head kicks (clinched the 1st time but got caught later) but most of the fight he was clearly winning

granted the Roop fight was controversial and many thought he lost but he had his last dominant win against a top hanked guy when he ran through Bart (10-8d him in the 1st and handily won the 3rd)

I hank him in 5th tier as a clear top 10 personally (tho with how Max is going with 4 sturaight top wins and Frankie prolly not for long - plus FW talent now is ridic and guys like Straus might make it to my 4th tier)

--

1. Aldo



2. Faber


3. MTB
4. Pequeno
5. Conor (some might say too high and id understand why, but hes been dominant at the weight, only 3 top wins, maybe 4 depending on Siver, but the Aldo win is one of the best wins in MMA history)

6. Chad
7. Patricio
8. Pat Curran
9. Hioki
10. Frankie (higher peak than anyone besides Aldo in FW history IMO, one of the handful of FWs in history who were hanked P4P - Aldo, Faber, MTB, Pequeno, Conor being others [Hioki mightve been fringe at one point] but hes only been fighting @ 145 for 3 years, plus wasted time on TUF and had an irrelevant win against BJ. longevity matters to me)

11. Imanari
12. Lamas
13. Jeff Curran
14. Cub

15. Inoue
16. Sandro
17. Max
18. Straus
19. Kawajiri/Hominick
20. Maeda

Kid Yamamoto peakwise is up there but with the state of the division at the time and him fighting bigger guys tough to hank him

what say u dawgies

hioki-1.jpg
 
Man was he a disappointment. FW Cro Cop in the terms of bust when he got into the UFC. I thought he'd be the guy to challenge Jose.
 
Homeless Infant said:
Man was he a disappointment. FW Cro Cop in the terms of bust when he got into the UFC. I thought he'd be the guy to challenge Jose.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but he was also a case of one of the biggest robberies I've seen in the UFC—He beat guida. I also thought he beat Lamas, too. Lamas spent like 12 minutes in a submission attempt.
 
fortheo said:
Yeah, but he was also a case of one of the biggest robberies I've seen in the UFC—He beat guida. I also thought he beat Lamas, too. Lamas spent like 12 minutes in a submission attempt.
Click to expand...
I remember Guida definitely winning that fight. It was close though. But you do kind of have a point on the Lamas fight.
 
Homeless Infant said:
I remember Guida definitely winning that fight. It was close though. But you do kind of have a point on the Lamas fight.
Click to expand...

Man. I remember Hioki for sure outstriking Guida 2 to 1 and throwing nearly every sub in the book at Guida while Guida tried to lay in guard.

The lamas one is more contentious in my mind.
 
fortheo said:
Yeah, but he was also a case of one of the biggest robberies I've seen in the UFC—He beat guida. I also thought he beat Lamas, too. Lamas spent like 12 minutes in a submission attempt.
Click to expand...

I thought Lamas won but that 2nd hound was weird.

He def got hobbed against Clay but many also thought Roop beat him
 
There was a shitposter on this site named Ebanataw whose signature claimed Hioki to be the #1 FW circa 2011. Man I don't miss him. He left soon after Hioki lost.
 
ExitLUPin said:
I thought Lamas won but that 2nd hound was weird.

He def got hobbed against Clay but many also thought Roop beat him
Click to expand...

Yeah. He was one of those Japanese guys that just looked lethargic once he came to America.
 
fortheo said:
Yeah. He was one of those Japanese guys that just looked lethargic once he came to America.
Click to expand...

Yeah that weird Japanese thing of inactivity/not pushing at certain times is sturange. Lots of super close SDs in Japan because of it. I blame the low testosterone tho there are exceptions
 
Kind of like your posts and threads... Good enough to get it done on a minor level but a total washout at the top level.
 
Homeless Infant said:
I remember Guida definitely winning that fight. It was close though. But you do kind of have a point on the Lamas fight.
Click to expand...

I gave it to Hioki because it appeared he was outstriking Guida from the bottom. It wasn't like the Pettis fight, where Guida laid on top of him AND stifled his offense. Hioki was really the only one doing anything, as far as I recall.
 
Substance Abuse said:
Kind of like your posts and threads... Good enough to get it done on a minor level but a total washout at the top level.
Click to expand...

>still triggered months after i sonned u

R O F L

Also Hioki has top level wins at the weight but I'm sure u and those voting top 16-25 never followed MMA or the FW division pre UFC or outside WEC
 
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Ive been a big fan for such a long time and don't care where he ranks all time. I'm not sure if I'll ever be able to proses what happened to his UFC run. I really don't like thinking about it.
 
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