Did TRT prove that actual MMA evolvement was exaggerated?

blkdynamite

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People like to claim that the fighter of today are much more skilled than yesteryear. There is truth of that but I look how far Brock Lesnar went with just a wrestling base and I wonder. When old timers like Vitor Belfort and Dan Henderson leveled the playing with TRT they were killing the supposed more evolved youngsters. Evolvement should have been able to trump experience, right? I think that MMA hasn't evolved as much as people think. The same skill sets have proven most effective. I think what has evolved is training and PED usage. I think "prime" Belfort and Hendo would do just fine in today's MMA.
 
TRT/PED's do not give you more skill magically.. It gives you the ability to train harder and recover better and maintain a high level longer. That being said there is a lot to be said for experience.

I agree that Prime Belfort/Hendo would do well and that the TRT usage extended that Prime time and also allowed them to take advantage of the years of experience that they gained while still being able to perform at the high level.
 
You are right. People claim all of these guys are "more evolved" but it's nonsense. Forrest Griffin couldn't even beat Dan Severn when they fought and Severn is a million years old. Mark Coleman beat Stephen Bonnar. All of the "new breed" bombed out and disappeared in a couple of years and the guys from the top 10 a decade ago are still around.
 
Mma evolution is a myth at the higher weight classes.
 
Apparently it's a real word, but who the fuck says "evolvement?"
 
HW has been dominated by the same soggy lookin fatties since the before time. We've introduced a few here and there , some of them soggier and fatter than the ones before, but the skill level hasn't changed much.
 
People like to claim that the fighter of today are much more skilled than yesteryear. There is truth of that but I look how far Brock Lesnar went with just a wrestling base and I wonder. When old timers like Vitor Belfort and Dan Henderson leveled the playing with TRT they were killing the supposed more evolved youngsters. Evolvement should have been able to trump experience, right? I think that MMA hasn't evolved as much as people think. The same skill sets have proven most effective. I think what has evolved is training and PED usage. I think "prime" Belfort and Hendo would do just fine in today's MMA.
Brock is NOT an example of how far you can go with a wrestling base.
 
HW has been dominated by the same soggy lookin fatties since the before time. We've introduced a few here and there , some of them soggier and fatter than the ones before, but the skill level hasn't changed much.

some tall guy steal your girl? you seem salty.
 
To me it's better to be wrestling / striking specialist and then go to mma, then it is to train mma from start... I would always sacrifice a little bit of well-roundness for a super-skill.
 
People like to claim that the fighter of today are much more skilled than yesteryear. There is truth of that but I look how far Brock Lesnar went with just a wrestling base and I wonder. When old timers like Vitor Belfort and Dan Henderson leveled the playing with TRT they were killing the supposed more evolved youngsters. Evolvement should have been able to trump experience, right? I think that MMA hasn't evolved as much as people think. The same skill sets have proven most effective. I think what has evolved is training and PED usage. I think "prime" Belfort and Hendo would do just fine in today's MMA.

Wonderboy came in and learned TDD. Now he's beating the shit out of everyone he fights. That's not much different than what Cro Cop did imo. Cormier didn't even have a pro MMA fight until he was 30 and now he's one of the best LHW's ever.

I would say that MMA hasn't evolved much at all since the mid 2000's. Different faces is all. People buy too much into the Rogan new breed hype. Rory was supposed to be the new breed and he's getting smashed buy Wonderboy who is basically welterweight Cro Cop and getting smashed by old man Lawler. Cain was supposed to be new breed and got beat standing by a a guy who is 40 with sub par stand up skills.
 
Most mentioned abused TRT to the point of becoming an extreme PED. If they kept it in normal ranges, they would have looked different. When given an absolute max and you come in above it, you're past TRT and on a cycle.
 
Ummm, it has evolved as far as depth. The top guys from ten years ago can still compete, the ones who have stayed in shape and aren't damaged, I mean. But they dont, and couldnt, dominate like before. There were many more scrubs to thump out for Vitor, Dan, Wandy, Chuck, Franklin, etc.

It is very hard to win consistently in todays landscape, because the top 10s are filled with well rounded, proven fighters, whereas there was always a Tre Telligman or Edwin Dewees to face every second fight.
 
... When old timers like Vitor Belfort and Dan Henderson leveled the playing with TRT they were killing the supposed more evolved youngsters. ...

Vitor and Dan didn't just randomly decide to stop learning new things at some arbitrary age. They evolved with the sport. Most people just don't have careers long enough for that to really happen.
 
TRT helped Vitor evolve into a wheel kicking death machine.
 
New breed makes me laugh every damned time.
 
TRT/PED's do not give you more skill magically.. It gives you the ability to train harder and recover better and maintain a high level longer. That being said there is a lot to be said for experience.

I agree that Prime Belfort/Hendo would do well and that the TRT usage extended that Prime time and also allowed them to take advantage of the years of experience that they gained while still being able to perform at the high level.

I don't understand why people feel the need to say this....still. We all know this. These guys in the UFC have the requisite skill. They aren't bums who randomly decided to roid one day and become great. They already have the skill so yes, the second part of your statement is correct. I just don't get why people feel the need to say the first part. It almost makes you sound like a PED apologist.
 
Vitor and Dan didn't just randomly decide to stop learning new things at some arbitrary age. They evolved with the sport. Most people just don't have careers long enough for that to really happen.
Dan's skill set has actually devolved from when he was younger. I can't even remember the last time I've seen him win a grappling exchange.
 
People like to claim that the fighter of today are much more skilled than yesteryear. There is truth of that but I look how far Brock Lesnar went with just a wrestling base and I wonder. When old timers like Vitor Belfort and Dan Henderson leveled the playing with TRT they were killing the supposed more evolved youngsters. Evolvement should have been able to trump experience, right? I think that MMA hasn't evolved as much as people think. The same skill sets have proven most effective. I think what has evolved is training and PED usage. I think "prime" Belfort and Hendo would do just fine in today's MMA.

TRT Vitor would kill 20 year old Vitor though.

Same with Hendo. TRT Hendo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pride Hendo in his earlier years.

What TRT allowed is that this older fighters COULD evolve their games without having to lose speed and strength.
And in some instance be actually even stronger than before.

So while younger fighters are on average far more skilled than the old lions .... some old lions have been constantly getting better as well skill wise but need TRT or other PEDs to have the physical ability to compete with the younger guys.
 
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