How Do I Counter a Wrestler?

[350 lbs fist]

^^True

Aldo has a nasty trick of throwing a slow and ludicrously high jab baiting the opponent in for the shot and then bam counters with a knee.

But before thinking about "magic bullet" counters stopping takedowns and getting back up again should be a priority.

[SummerStriker]

Originally Posted by 350 lbs fist

Aldo has a nasty trick of throwing a slow and ludicrously high jab baiting the opponent in for the shot and then bam counters with a knee.

That's funny. Thank you.

[KounterPunch]

Post with your lead hand ......drop the right .
Good footwork.

[Soul Rebel 2]

Originally Posted by SummerStriker

That's funny. Thank you.

Well....he caught a former champion in Mike Brown with that exact move several times in their match so it clearly works.

And speaking of Aldo, he next opponent is also a striker with an idiosyncratic way of dealing with grapplers. Pettis likes to latch on guillotines when his opponent grabs his leg. Its a good way to deter a takedown because it may end up with your opponent spiking himself on the head. Also, due to the deterxity in his legs and his ability to move his head off his back he can slip punches from a standing while passing the arm for a triangle. You can also get arm drags using the same approach.

[devante]

Originally Posted by Soul Rebel 2

Well....he caught a former champion in Mike Brown with that exact move several times in their match so it clearly works.

And speaking of Aldo, he next opponent is also a striker with an idiosyncratic way of dealing with grapplers. Pettis likes to latch on guillotines when his opponent grabs his leg. Its a good way to deter a takedown because it may end up with your opponent spiking himself on the head. Also, due to the deterxity in his legs and his ability to move his head off his back he can slip punches from a standing while passing the arm for a triangle. You can also get arm drags using the same approach.

most of these guys put in alot of work w/wrestlers, in the case of pettis his coach says they do everything in an mma environment; so that the fighters are constantly working on transitioning the tech w/in the context of the sport they are in.

pettis is working w/askren, among others; the level of wrestler he works w/constantly in practice is so far ahead of who he faces in the cage, his dev of legit wrestling def/counters is what allows him to maximize the other tech/avenues he uses to counter wrestlers.

same w/aldo, they put so much time in def takedowns, working in the clinch; that they have that ability to focus and maximize their other counters, i.e. footwork, knees, uppercuts, etc.

[Soul Rebel 2]

Originally Posted by devante

most of these guys put in alot of work w/wrestlers, in the case of pettis his coach says they do everything in an mma environment; so that the fighters are constantly working on transitioning the tech w/in the context of the sport they are in.

pettis is working w/askren, among others; the level of wrestler he works w/constantly in practice is so far ahead of who he faces in the cage, his dev of legit wrestling def/counters is what allows him to maximize the other tech/avenues he uses to counter wrestlers.

same w/aldo, they put so much time in def takedowns, working in the clinch; that they have that ability to focus and maximize their other counters, i.e. footwork, knees, uppercuts, etc.

I think that putting in work with grapplers and being well rounded should just be taken as a given seeing as its an obvious corner stone of success in MMA. Its no secret that iron sharpens iron, its dogma. Remember, the TS could have (should have) gone to the grappling forum if he wanted tips on TD defence or getting to his feet.

[ssullivan80]

Originally Posted by devante

most of these guys put in alot of work w/wrestlers, in the case of pettis his coach says they do everything in an mma environment; so that the fighters are constantly working on transitioning the tech w/in the context of the sport they are in.

pettis is working w/askren, among others; the level of wrestler he works w/constantly in practice is so far ahead of who he faces in the cage, his dev of legit wrestling def/counters is what allows him to maximize the other tech/avenues he uses to counter wrestlers.

same w/aldo, they put so much time in def takedowns, working in the clinch; that they have that ability to focus and maximize their other counters, i.e. footwork, knees, uppercuts, etc.

Well said, again it's a fairly simple metric in my opinion. The better you are at wrestling and the more confident you are in your ability to get back up, defend and neutralize a wrestler the better you'll be at striking against one. What makes guy's like Aldo, Petis, Silva, BJ, Diaz bros, etc....... consistently effective at outstriking and countering wrestlers is that they can do so confidently because they are capable enough wrestlers/grapplers themselves that they don't let the "threat of the takedown" deter them or make their striking tentative or timid. They can confidently use their striking and they afford themselves more attempts at being able to counter wrestlers because they are able to get back up, defend takedowns and are capable enough on the mat that even when they are taken down they still pose a threat and can defend themselves intelligently.

A good stand up fighter who becomes overly cautious of the takedown or wrestling can actually give away his striking advantage to the wrestler. The wrestler can come forward, be agressive and attack a timid opponent. It happens far more often then you'd think! Guy's like Rashad, GSP, Kos, Bader, etc..... have all won stand up wars against better stand up fighters because their opponents were overly cautious or timid of being taken down. Their is a reason that the OH right is often a wrestlers favorite weapon, and that punch has ended many of fights. Strikers often criticize the hell out that punch in MMA, yet it continues to be effective because the threat of being taken down is the greatest threat a good striker who can't wrestle faces in MMA.

[devante]

Originally Posted by Soul Rebel 2

I think that putting in work with grapplers and being well rounded should just be taken as a given seeing as its an obvious corner stone of success in MMA. Its no secret that iron sharpens iron, its dogma. Remember, the TS could have (should have) gone to the grappling forum if he wanted tips on TD defence or getting to his feet.

should be common sense, but its often not; as alot of pure strikers think cause they trained grappling w/some avg or poor grapplers, they think they can def shots and honestly they can't..not against competent guys.

whats worse is they only think of def the takedown, not getting that against good wrestlers-judoka-samboist; you are gonna get put on your ass, the only thing you can do is a)make them have to work harder to get that (allowing urself opp to land shots) b)have some control over the td (so you aren't taken down clean/completely) and learning how to def/att/counter. C is the most likely..and the most necessary once you know you can get back up or eff def/counter/attack, you become that much better on your feet and overall because your aware of the threat of going down, but not scared of it. There is a diff.

i grapple much more than i strike, like actually spar/etc; so if i face a grappler/wrestler in an mma environment i can make things effective (i.e. baiting, backing up, potshotting). Because i know how to grapple, if i was terrified or unskilled on the ground; then i wouldn't be effective at all on the feet, as sully said.

[fullmount87]

Disclaimer, I've not really sparred any high level wrestlers, but I'm also just amateur so take my tips as they are. My counters to fighting wrestlers:

1) Most wrestlers or guys who are primarily grapplers really aren't used to being punched, so make sure you are punching them to turn their head, etc.

2) Don't over commit. If you start touching them with your combos, expect them to shoot. They might have a counter punch or two but they will almost always shoot or clinch. When they shoot or try to clinch, disengage with your footwork, sprawl, etc.

3) Use knees, lead hand uppercuts, etc. to make them hesistant to shoot in on you.

4) Practice getting back up. Practice getting butterfly guard and popping back up. Don't get suckered into "working" your way back up if they are the superior grappler. Give everything you have to get back up, right away.

5) If they are training partners, have them teach you wrestling. You will never beat them at just wrestling, but you'd be surprised what a few tricks or reps will do for you.

[cuality]

Mousasi/Lawal or Roop/Grispi comes to mind.