Does Cung Le prove that kung-fu can be incorporated succesfully in MMA?

[SuperLuigi]

If im not mistaken sanshou is a form of Wushu, not kung fu

[miraclecomeback]

It proves sanshou works

[Seph]

MMA has evolved to the point where it is now all about the fighter not the style. MMA is its own style now.

Sambo is a great example of this, it is a flawed technique in spots but when he have super great athletes using it they are going to excel.

Cung Le is just one of those types of alpha humans that just excels at what ever he sets his mind too. Be it Wushu, BJJ or wrestling.

[LEGS MAHONEY]

Originally Posted by syncopizer

This.

San Shou isn't traditional Kung Fu by any means. Back in the mid 1900s the Chinese got their arses handed to them by the Thai's in a full contact martial arts exhibition. As a response to the humiliation by the much, much, much smaller country with a tiny talent pool comparatively, the Chinese effectively adopted Thai/Kick boxing and re-packaged it with the name San Shou "Kung Fu", which seems to apply to any "martial art" in China.

In short, it's kind of like their fake iPhones.

This is false. Antonio Graceffo has debunked the shaolin vs muay thai match theory ( It never occurred.) rather sanda came about because china was inspired by their fellow commies in Russia who were working on their own military combat style so the Chinese decided to create their own.
http://www.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/...hp?article=529

Originally Posted by SuperLuigi

If im not mistaken sanshou is a form of Wushu, not kung fu

Wushu just literally means "martial arts" while kung fu means "hard work." There not different forms of anything. Though sometimes the acrobatic form competitions the government created is referred to as "wushu"

[sprucelees]

thanks for the vids

[hoyle1911]

Sanda literally translates to "mix fight." Other than the ground game it looks remarkably like MMA. Kungfu literally translates to "work." It's incredibly broad.

When you throw away the forms and only keep what's effective, of course Kung Fu works. It's punching, kicking, trips, and throws. Why wouldn't those techniques work?

It's what Bruce Lee was working so hard towards decades ago, which is why it's perplexing when modern MMA forums make fun of him. Take whatever handful of techniques from each style that actually works, then mix them into an overall philosophy of combat. We take it for granted that mixed fighting is so common nowadays, whereas decades ago huge holy wars erupted about which school of fighting was best. They were all pointless arguments.

[Dragonseeker]

Originally Posted by syncopizer

This.

San Shou isn't traditional Kung Fu by any means. Back in the mid 1900s the Chinese got their arses handed to them by the Thai's in a full contact martial arts exhibition. As a response to the humiliation by the much, much, much smaller country with a tiny talent pool comparatively, the Chinese effectively adopted Thai/Kick boxing and re-packaged it with the name San Shou "Kung Fu", which seems to apply to any "martial art" in China.

In short, it's kind of like their fake iPhones.

That is a nice story. Now read up on the actual history of San Shou.

San Shou is the official full contact fighting sport of modern Wushu which is rapidly growing in popularity both in the US and abroad. As an integral part of most Wushu competitions, San Shou has been an important event at the World Wushu Championships since its inception in 1991. Presently San Shou competitions are held in over 75 countries world wide. Recently San Shou has also become a professional sport in America.

The word "San Shou" also spelled "Sanda" translates as "unbound hand" and refers to free fighting where the rules are designed to most accurately simulate actual combat. San Shou matches are fought on a raised platform called the "Lei Tai". Historically, the Lei Tai dates back centuries in China where challenge matches were fought both bare handed and also with weapons with no rules�often resulting in death or serious injury. At the National Chinese tournament in Nanking in 1928, the fights on the Lei Tai were so brutal that the final 12 contestants were not permitted to fight for fear of killing off some of the great masters of the time. So changes were needed.

Modern San Shou developed into a sport about the same time as modern Wushu during the 1960�s by the Chinese Government. In order to define a standard kung fu fighting style, the great masters from all over China were given the task of organizing the huge heritage of Chinese martial arts in to a system of rules in which different styles could complete. Protective equipment was also added to further reduce the risk of serious injury.

The rules of San Shou allow for a wide array of full contact punching, kicking, takedowns and throws derived from the traditional application of Chinese martial arts. Finishing hold (chokes, arm locks etc.) have been excluded from the rules which forces the fight to continue at a fast pace. San Shou addresses the three ranges of fighting�kicking, punching and grappling which adds great realism to the sport. A fighter can win by a knockout or by points, points are also awarded for the techniques according to effectiveness. In a tournament, you fight for 2 rounds of 2 minutes each, plus a third round in case the first 2 score even. Forcing the opponent off of the platform is also a major technique of San Shou. It is a mistake to think of San Shou as just Kick Boxing because the strategies of San Shou are very different.

http://www.sanshou.com/article-sanshou.html

[Dragonseeker]

Originally Posted by SuperLuigi

If im not mistaken sanshou is a form of Wushu, not kung fu

Wushu means "martial arts" in Chinese. So technically, Muay Thai is a form of Wushu.

Kung Fu means "hard work" but people today use that term to describe martial arts.

So San Shou is both wushu and kung fu.

Today, the government officially recognize two kinds of wushu:

Taolu - forms (Jet Li, Donnie Yen, Wu Jing)
San Shou - sparring (Cung Le, Liu Hailong, Zhang Kai Yin, Zhang Tiequan)

[KarateStylist]

Originally Posted by MysticNinjaJay

1. I don't think that doing kata necessarily hurts your performance. The real problem is if this is the major basis of your training rather than training for a full-contact fight.

2. If Machida stopped doing kata altogether he might still lose to Shogun or Jones. That being said I would love to see Machida in rematches with both.

1. What's your authority? I mean the Cung Le Smash_O of Franklin is a real commercial for cross-training boxing with a TMA base.... I haven't seen anything about Cung Le doing kata routines.... I mean modern methods for modern results.... the UFC is true MMA.... not an exhibition.... RIGHT?

2. Of course Machida might still lose. Jones, for one, is only getting better. Shogun's on a different course, of course- ha ha.... Still, shogun's Muay Thai has outfought Machida 2x.... I think a switch from karate point striking is in order don't you????

KarateStylist

[Sohei]

Forms are ok to warm up with. But to be a good fighter you have to spar, spar, spar.