Sherdog Mixed Martial Arts Forums

Go Back   Sherdog Mixed Martial Arts Forums > Training Discussion > Grappling Technique

Grappling Technique You don't know a heel hook from a toe hold, and that's why you need to come here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-29-2012, 09:06 PM   #1
Hubris Rex

White Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 84
vCash: 500
Question born out of pure ignorance about attacking a leg

Okay, I hope I can get this to make sense, apologies for poor grammar and tragic amount of run on sentences. But, I literally know zero about the technical details of this.

So, in those fights were one guy is on the ground (he got rocked, or slipped, etc) and his legs are in that sort of 'I'm gonna up kick you' position, and the other dude isn't jumping on him but sort of wading in there and pushing his legs around (really sorry, but I can't think of a specific example but I know I've seen it) why doesn't he just grab his leg and uhmmm you know, ju jitsu it?

I just feel like I've seen this a lot, and I'm always confused because they seem quite vulnerable in that position.

The only thing I can think of is the dude standing up doesn't know how to 'jits' his leg or that kind of attack is really risky...or I need to drink less when watching UFC.

Thanks in advance for any responses.

__________________
-Mir -Palhares -Cerrone -GSP -Hunt -Jacare
-Edgar -Maia -Nate Diaz -Machida
-Swanson -Uncle Creepy -Penn
Hubris Rex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:09 PM   #2
Einarr

Brown Belt
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Osoto Gari'ing your mom.
Posts: 4,765
vCash: 50
Why doesn't he just "'jits' his leg"? Do you even train?

Edit: Okay, i'll give you a somewhat serious answer. Guard passing isn't easy, especially when you're sweaty and having to be wary of upkicks. Chances are that if a fighter is happy to lay on his back tempting the other guy to engage with his guard he probably has a good guard, so the risk/reward balance of engaging a guy with a good guard or waiting for the referee is heavily favored to the latter rather than the former.


Last edited by Einarr; 11-29-2012 at 09:27 PM.
Einarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:10 PM   #3
Hubris Rex

White Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 84
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Einarr View Post
Why doesn't he just "'jits' his leg"? Do you even train?
Nope, I probably would have asked the guy training me, lol. I get most of my info from Joe Rogan's commentary and you guys.

Okay, why doesn't he kneebar? heel hook? can't think of another one...

__________________
-Mir -Palhares -Cerrone -GSP -Hunt -Jacare
-Edgar -Maia -Nate Diaz -Machida
-Swanson -Uncle Creepy -Penn
Hubris Rex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:13 PM   #4
KGB256

Purple Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 1,730
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubris Rex View Post
Okay, I hope I can get this to make sense, apologies for poor grammar and tragic amount of run on sentences. But, I literally know zero about the technical details of this.

So, in those fights were one guy is on the ground (he got rocked, or slipped, etc) and his legs are in that sort of 'I'm gonna up kick you' position, and the other dude isn't jumping on him but sort of wading in there and pushing his legs around (really sorry, but I can't think of a specific example but I know I've seen it) why doesn't he just grab his leg and uhmmm you know, ju jitsu it?

I just feel like I've seen this a lot, and I'm always confused because they seem quite vulnerable in that position.

The only thing I can think of is the dude standing up doesn't know how to 'jits' his leg or that kind of attack is really risky...or I need to drink less when watching UFC.

Thanks in advance for any responses.
Just spitballing here, but it's because the guy on the ground has two legs. You grab one of his feet, he blasts you in the chin with the other one, and then when he's doing his post-fight victory interview you're on the canvas picking up chicklets.

KGB256 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:14 PM   #5
TheHereticJay
I scoff at your belt rankings
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Beijing, China
Posts: 2,009
vCash: 500
Because in mma it's not good to end up on bottom. Many people believe if you fail to "jitz the leg", then they'll always wind up on top of you and can then beat your face to a bloody pulp. Also, the addition of someone being able to kick you with the free leg would make it more difficult to get that initial grip I'd believe.

TheHereticJay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:17 PM   #6
KGB256

Purple Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 1,730
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubris Rex View Post
Nope, I probably would have asked the guy training me, lol. I get most of my info from Joe Rogan's commentary and you guys.

Okay, why doesn't he kneebar? heel hook? can't think of another one...
Standing against someone's open guard is not a position where either or those submissions are available. The best bet would be either an ankle lock or a toe hold, but you'd have to do something to deal with the other leg, otherwise you're getting kicked in the mouth.

KGB256 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:21 PM   #7
Einarr

Brown Belt
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Osoto Gari'ing your mom.
Posts: 4,765
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubris Rex View Post
Nope, I probably would have asked the guy training me, lol. I get most of my info from Joe Rogan's commentary and you guys.

Okay, why doesn't he kneebar? heel hook? can't think of another one...
Grabbing a leg and falling back for a leglock is a high risk/high reward tactic. Watch Ken Shamrock's fights and see how many times he ends up in a bad position from doing just what you're suggesting, even Toquinho sometimes loses position going for his signature heelhook. Besides, most jiujiteiros who aren't leglock specialists would be looking for the pass and to secure side control (from where you can strike effectively, control your opponent and apply submissions) rather than the leglock. And if the guy feels he has a worse chance on the ground than he does standing he won't want to engage on the ground anyway.

Einarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:25 PM   #8
Hubris Rex

White Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 84
vCash: 500
Cool, thank you for all the replies. I didn't think about the dangers of getting kicked in the grill with the other leg. I've never been in a fight or any sort of physical competition (I'm a librarian, we tend to be a docile lot.)

And I'm guessing 'jitz-ing the leg' isn't technical term. I've been thinking about trying to train and I guess telling them I want to learn to jitz legs probably wouldn't translate well, lol.

Anyways, thanks again, your knowledge is appreciated.

__________________
-Mir -Palhares -Cerrone -GSP -Hunt -Jacare
-Edgar -Maia -Nate Diaz -Machida
-Swanson -Uncle Creepy -Penn
Hubris Rex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:26 PM   #9
Hubris Rex

White Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 84
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Einarr View Post
even Toquinho sometimes loses position going for his signature heelhook. .

Is that what went down v. Belcher?

__________________
-Mir -Palhares -Cerrone -GSP -Hunt -Jacare
-Edgar -Maia -Nate Diaz -Machida
-Swanson -Uncle Creepy -Penn
Hubris Rex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2012, 09:28 PM   #10
KGB256

Purple Belt
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 1,730
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hubris Rex View Post
Cool, thank you for all the replies. I didn't think about the dangers of getting kicked in the grill with the other leg. I've never been in a fight or any sort of physical competition (I'm a librarian, we tend to be a docile lot.)

And I'm guessing 'jitz-ing the leg' isn't technical term. I've been thinking about trying to train and I guess telling them I want to learn to jitz legs probably wouldn't translate well, lol.

Anyways, thanks again, your knowledge is appreciated.
Is the word "attack" not in your vocabulary? (i.e. "why doesn't he attack the leg?")

KGB256 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Latest Threads



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:35 AM.

Sherdog.com Forum Rules Clear Cookies Social Groups Lost Password
Contact Us - Sherdog Forums - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Top - AdChoices

Skin made by Alex. © iStyles.uni.cc Powered by vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
forums.sherdog.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.
monitoring_string = "fd5733925866a04e50edd70f38dfaa35"
monitoring_string = "603ac9fff68f23709f2a42bf5e29272b"