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Standup Technique Jab, right hook, left cross... is it really that hard? Talk about it here.

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Old 03-01-2012, 08:32 PM   #11
Sinister
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Angles are the right answer. As-is knowing how to turn your opponent. Get them close, then pivot. Reel them in, pivot again. You KNOW she's going to come forward, and she's going to barrage you. If she's slower than you are, you can use foot movement. Step back, then to a side, then pivot. Jab to lead her into it, then punch after you pivot. She'll try to reset right in front of you to keep on punching, but you'll have the angle.

If she's faster than you, you can run her into single shots. Like say, an uppercut to the gut. Then do one of two things, either bump her with your shoulder, or grab her.

Miguel Cotto did a phenomenal job of neutralizing Antonio Margarito's aggression in their second bout with these principals:



Look how Cotto always steps JUST out of range. But not far enough to be running from Toni. Also how he punches and turns Toni so Toni can't get set. And when Toni runs at him, Cotto uses his shortness to get leverage to drive Toni back like a little bull-dozer.

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Old 03-02-2012, 06:12 AM   #12
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^ That's some good stuff right there, Sinister.

I don't like how often he seems to be stepping into the path of the cross though, but i'm sure he had his reasons.

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Old 03-02-2012, 07:15 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Katriona1992 View Post
Long story short, I've veen sparring with some of the taller/stronger peeps in the gym and am having particular problems with one that is around 5' (11cm) taller and 20 pounds (9kg) heavier.

The problem isn't so much with her strength advantage but more with her style since she is a swammer. She throws very heavy punches non-stop. By non stop I mean she just wallops at me from the very second the round starts and, even though she's really hitting my arms most of the time and it doesn't really hurt, it also means that I can't hit back since I am likely to get punched. I've tried countering but there isn't really a pattern to what she is throwing. I've tried leaning back but is still tagged since her arms are just that much longer. The only thing that seems to be working as of right now is to keep on the outside and sneak in shots by using angles every now and then.

My problem is not so much about how to "win" in a spar against her (due the weight difference we will never fight anyways) but what to do if I actually meet someone like her in the ring? We usually go for 5 x 3 in the gym so I usually wait until late round 4/early round 5 when she's nice and tired then go in for combos. However, since a usual match is only 3 x 3 mins I was wondering what are some tactics that could use then (since obviously she won't be tired out by then)?

Thank you.
when she tries to combo you nonstop let say youre trapped in a corner hmmm do a cross arm block so you can see her, then push her using your arms in that formation..when she comes back greet her with jabs, jab and back away, use jab often to disrupt her rythm. then come back with combinations. also you can try lots of cardio workouts (jogging) i used to spar with that kind of oponent and covering up standing in the ropes wont do any good because your oponent has monster cardio.

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Old 03-02-2012, 08:08 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinister View Post
Angles are the right answer. As-is knowing how to turn your opponent. Get them close, then pivot. Reel them in, pivot again. You KNOW she's going to come forward, and she's going to barrage you. If she's slower than you are, you can use foot movement. Step back, then to a side, then pivot. Jab to lead her into it, then punch after you pivot. She'll try to reset right in front of you to keep on punching, but you'll have the angle.

If she's faster than you, you can run her into single shots. Like say, an uppercut to the gut. Then do one of two things, either bump her with your shoulder, or grab her.

Miguel Cotto did a phenomenal job of neutralizing Antonio Margarito's aggression in their second bout with these principals:



Look how Cotto always steps JUST out of range. But not far enough to be running from Toni. Also how he punches and turns Toni so Toni can't get set. And when Toni runs at him, Cotto uses his shortness to get leverage to drive Toni back like a little bull-dozer.
Man, his movement and distance is crazy good. You can see how it takes a little off Toni's attack over the fight (what you call getting set). Not many are going to do that that way. I just realized how cool it was to take a topic and watch film on how it is done. I need to watch more quality boxing.

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Old 03-02-2012, 08:51 AM   #15
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Cotto is really fucking good. Would like to see him rematch Pacman someday.

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Old 03-02-2012, 01:48 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChachiKiller View Post
Man, his movement and distance is crazy good. You can see how it takes a little off Toni's attack over the fight (what you call getting set). Not many are going to do that that way. I just realized how cool it was to take a topic and watch film on how it is done. I need to watch more quality boxing.
If you want to see something strategically applied, chances are I can find a fight where it happened.

And for everyone who commented, yes I've watched that fight at least 3 times and Cotto fought precisely perfectly to neutralize Toni. His up-jab made Toni stand up too tall, taking away his leverage. His lateral movement and pivoting kept Toni off-balance and unable to sit down on most of his punches. His ability to hide on the inside made it so that Toni had to take sting off of his punches just to be able to land anything. And finally when Toni did get close enough, Miguel just walked forward with his head in Toni's chest, rocking him back onto his heels where his punches just became playful taps. But it's best observed by watching the whole affair:

Cotto VS Margarito II (PELEA COMPLETA) 03 de Diciembre del 2011 HD - YouTube

Spanish broadcast, but worth it.

(And it's a replay that was on public broadcast, so no copyright issue.)

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Old 03-02-2012, 05:05 PM   #17
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You can go the smart way, which Sinister outlined, or the not so smart way.

Getting angles, circling away to the center of the ring when she puts pressure on you, and using your footwork to keep her moving around the center of the ring and not completely stationary to unload on you is ideal.

Or, you can allow her to get you to the ropes, work inside her reach, use a stiff-arm jab when she pushes foreword (Swarmers always do this) and then a 'jolt' jab to keep her open and work the body up close in the clinch range with inside fighting. With heavy hands and being a swarmer she will out point you and hurt you, you would need a finish if competing.

Circling away back to the center of the ring is key. This resetting keeps her moving. You know she tuckers out, she does not have the gas tank to be a good swarmer, and lacks technique to really out work you. Circle away from her power hand when you approach the ropes and reset to ensure you have space to create angles effectively. Remember that you can angle away just enough to tag her body and then circle back before she hits you. This will frustrate her and force her to work harder.

I dont know of many good circling boxing matches, or resources. I wish I could assist more.

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Old 03-02-2012, 06:26 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Katriona1992 View Post
Yep. Just western boxing.
Damn, that takes alot out of the advice I would give you. I would say work uppercuts to her body and head when she comes in and left hooks when you angle out. When you throw the uppercuts keep your head close to hers.

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Old 03-03-2012, 11:01 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinister View Post
If you want to see something strategically applied, chances are I can find a fight where it happened.

And for everyone who commented, yes I've watched that fight at least 3 times and Cotto fought precisely perfectly to neutralize Toni. His up-jab made Toni stand up too tall, taking away his leverage. His lateral movement and pivoting kept Toni off-balance and unable to sit down on most of his punches. His ability to hide on the inside made it so that Toni had to take sting off of his punches just to be able to land anything. And finally when Toni did get close enough, Miguel just walked forward with his head in Toni's chest, rocking him back onto his heels where his punches just became playful taps. But it's best observed by watching the whole affair:

Cotto VS Margarito II (PELEA COMPLETA) 03 de Diciembre del 2011 HD - YouTube

Spanish broadcast, but worth it.

(And it's a replay that was on public broadcast, so no copyright issue.)
Sin, I know you said Pac's best strength against PBF is that he's an offensive machine. I'd be interested to know some fights where volume punchers were able to overcome an opponents superior defense. PWill/Wright perhaps?? I don't know if there have been boxers with defense as sound as PBF but something close would be nice. I loved when George Foreman used to commentate on HBO and he would always say "That's the way you beat a master boxer, you make em' fight!"

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